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keiser1's picture
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sub upgrade?
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Hi, 

I'm looking at changing my sub to if possible improve the sound quality of my system. I've not really had chance to listen to a lot of subs so I'd like some advice on the subject, and if it will make much difference at all. I'd like to change to a B&W sub to match the rest of the front sound stage. The PV1D is way off my budget so I've been looking at the B&W ASW610 and the bigger 610XP. 

Has anyone got any advice on this and if it's worth the change?

Thanks.

 

Son_of_SJ's picture
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RE: sub upgrade?

Yet again - room size? Budget?

keiser1's picture
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RE: sub upgrade?

It's not big, sitting distance from the tv is 2.9m, budget up to £700

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RE: sub upgrade?

The SVS SB1000 at £499 should do the trick nicely, and will reach much deeper than the ASW610, and with greater authority too. Stick to a sealed sub as it will be used with small satellite speakers.

DavidF @FrankHarveyHiFi, Coventry.

"Long is the way, and hard, that out of hell leads up to light"

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RE: sub upgrade?

The SVS is a good shout, a very competent subwoofer. It would also be worth looking at Paradigm's range at this price point. The Sub SE and the DSP 3200. All of the above should fit with your speakers and give you a big lift in performance.

If it is a B&W one you want to stick with then your best bet is to push the budget as much as you can or save a little more and get a PV1 which is brilliant.

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RE: sub upgrade?

keiser1 wrote:

I'd like to change to a B&W sub to match the rest of the front sound stage.

It's a good idea to try to match satellite speakers, but I don't think it's necessary for the subwoofer to be from the same manufacturer.

David@FrankHarvey wrote:

The SVS SB1000 at £499 should do the trick nicely, and will reach much deeper than the ASW610, and with greater authority too. Stick to a sealed sub as it will be used with small satellite speakers.

You can find out more about the SVS SB100 here http://www.svsound.com/subwoofers/sealed-box/sb-1000#.UcgTpdgvwxU , click on the reviews tab. Adam Rayner reviewed it very favourably (He said "Basically, it can drop.") in the previous issue of Home Cinema Choice magazine (July 2013, number 222) but that review doesn't seem to be online yet, it may be online in another month or so.

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RE: sub upgrade?

And of course there's the slightly more capable SB12 too, which will still come within budget  Smile

DavidF @FrankHarveyHiFi, Coventry.

"Long is the way, and hard, that out of hell leads up to light"

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RE: sub upgrade?

Dont miss out on considering either a BK Monolith - for films for the money I think I could get this to sound amazing! or a BK XLS400 - Great All rounder - capable of fast and really textured musical bass - good for movies but it wont go mega deep, however most people wont be getting that mega deep bass in their rooms now anyway - they just think they are because they get a rumble - thats not what clwean deep bass sounds like.

 

These are both stunning subs for the money and probably are the best performance vs cost subs you can buy. 

 

You also need to factor in your Pioneer Receiver has no bass management - therefore unless you buy a sub with bass management buitl in then you should be upping the budget and including a dspeaker antimode into your equation as well.

Otherwise you might as well keep your exisitng sub as you will very unlikely get anything like even 50% of the benefit of the new sub!!  Thats is a hard fact of subwoofers in domestic untreated listening rooms

Meridian 861 V4 LPSU, HD621, Bryston 9BSST - GIK Acoustics

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RE: sub upgrade?

ellisdj wrote:
You also need to factor in your Pioneer Receiver has no bass management - therefore unless you buy a sub with bass management buitl in then you should be upping the budget and including a dspeaker antimode into your equation as well.

I think you mean sub EQ rather than management - the Pioneer does have full bass management including THX sub settings to play with Smile

DavidF @FrankHarveyHiFi, Coventry.

"Long is the way, and hard, that out of hell leads up to light"

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RE: sub upgrade?

The Pioneer wil set the phase and will put 3 points of standing wave correction if the LX72 has standing wave - this is not really very comprehensive at all and only goes down to 60hz.

It does very little to the sub, I think its expected that the owner will sort that bit out first - once the bass is set right mccac does a grand job with the distance and gets close with the level

 

I did mean Bass EQ though David yes you are right.

Meridian 861 V4 LPSU, HD621, Bryston 9BSST - GIK Acoustics

Monitor Audio PL100, PLC 150 (Soon), GXFX, SVS SB13 ULTRA

Custom Audio PC LPSU + Batts, JPLAY, JCAT and PPA Studio

65VT65, UD7007, Graham Slee Cables, Isotek, XLO

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RE: sub upgrade?

Thankyou all for the replies. I seem to be slightly confused with the whole calibration thing now, I've calibrated AV amps but never subs as I always presumed the amp would do the work for you. (or most of it)  The Paradigms subs have an option where you can buy a calibration mic, this again pushes the budget up, is it worth the money??  I was kind of set on the SVS SB1000 as David from Frank Harvey mentioned, can a calibration mic be purchased for this, without these mic's would the whole idea be a waste of time and money? Im not looking for a night and day differnce as i understand with my room layout and budget this is hard to achieve, I cant help but think my Mission sub is a weak spot in my set up as its no longer intergrated with the main front channels as it used to be with the Mission sats.

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RE: sub upgrade?

The Paradigm PBK (Perfect Bass Kit) is well worth going for and it is pretty simple to use, your dealer should be able to help you. This kit will only work with Paradigm subwoofers unfortunately and is not something you could use with the SVS. If you’re not going to move the subwoofer once it is placed in position it might be worth getting a loan of a PBK kit from your dealer if you go down the Paradigm route as you should only need to do the calibration once. If you are likely to want to experiment with it or move its position within the room it is worth investing in one.

 

I think you should expect a night and day difference from any of the subwoofers mentioned, the calibration is really the cherry on the top.

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RE: sub upgrade?

Should we assume your existing sub is placed in the the best position for performance? If placement options are limited as they often are, sub EQ can be helpful but it is unlikely to solve all the problems. IMO a cheaper sub that is well placed will perform better than a more expensive unit that is not. So if your sub is not in a great place, putting a more expensive unit in the same spot will not reap the expected reward. Room treatment is certainly effective but I always try and place the sub (if possible) in the best place before looking at other solutions. Just trying to help and save you money.

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RE: sub upgrade?

keiser1 wrote:
Thankyou all for the replies. I seem to be slightly confused with the whole calibration thing now, I've calibrated AV amps but never subs as I always presumed the amp would do the work for you. (or most of it)  The Paradigms subs have an option where you can buy a calibration mic, this again pushes the budget up, is it worth the money??  I was kind of set on the SVS SB1000 as David from Frank Harvey mentioned, can a calibration mic be purchased for this, without these mic's would the whole idea be a waste of time and money? Im not looking for a night and day differnce as i understand with my room layout and budget this is hard to achieve, I cant help but think my Mission sub is a weak spot in my set up as its no longer intergrated with the main front channels as it used to be with the Mission sats.

In the past, it hasn't really been common knowledge that not all AV receivers will EQ a sub during its auto setup. People are becoming wise to it though, and either buying an AV receiver that does (like those with Audyssey XT32), or purchasing an Antimode sub EQ unit (which comes with everything you need, including a microphone).

While I agree with much of what Martin has said, a quality subwoofer will still make quite a big difference over the one you are using at the moment (even without room EQ), and even if it isn't placed in the most ideal spot in your room. I think you'll be surprised at the difference you will hear.  If you can experiment with placement, all the better.

DavidF @FrankHarveyHiFi, Coventry.

"Long is the way, and hard, that out of hell leads up to light"

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