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Waxy's picture
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RE: Croft Acoustics RIAA or Graham Slee Reflex M

Al ears wrote:

Not too sure on the capabilities of the Onkyo phono stage but at least it's got one.

Save money on a phono preamp and buy more vinyl. :grin:

 

Better than the on-board stage of the Marantz PM6002 it replaced!

 

i need no excuses to buy more vinyl. Got a birthday coming up. A list has been made.  Dance 4

Analogue Works TT1 > Onkyo > B&W CM9

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RE: Croft Acoustics RIAA or Graham Slee Reflex M

Al ears wrote:

I hope he is as we do tend to push them a lot. Smile

Not too sure on the capabilities of the Onkyo phono stage but at least it's got one.

Save money on a phono preamp and buy more vinyl. :grin:

i was given this sort of advice and told I would struggle to better the phono stage in my Roksan Kandy.  I'm so glad I didn't listen.  I also question Al's advice about not buying a stage that is MM only.  To my mind it doesn't reduce the upgrade options and ensures you get best value for money for your immediate needs.

"Inspired" Manticore Mantra TT, Technics SL-7 TT, Graham Slee Reflex M phono preamp.  Cyrus CD8SE.  iMac, Raspberry Pi c/w HiFiBerry Digi c/w Volumio or Rune Audio, Arcam rDAC.  Roksan Kandy LIII amp, Spendor A5 speakers.

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RE: Croft Acoustics RIAA or Graham Slee Reflex M

Depending on how much beer I consume tonight, I may just hit that BUY button and take a punt. It's worked so far! Guess I have been lucky...

Analogue Works TT1 > Onkyo > B&W CM9

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RE: Croft Acoustics RIAA or Graham Slee Reflex M

Reading the recent replies in the thread, it worries me that the importance of a quality phono stage is not taken seriously enough? Its the first step along the amplification chain, and the most critical dealing with a minutely delicate signal. Get it wrong here and its down hill all the way, cant put back what has been lost, the word 'compromise' can be applied latter, but at this point, compromise is not an option IMHO? It goes back to the beginning of hifi as we know it . . . 'rubbish in, rubbish out'. Going to a lot of trouble to get the information off the record in the best way we can afford, then mess it up at the first hurdle?

Using a quality mm cartridge, why worry what happens in the future unless you have enough in the budget (most of us dont) to plan ahead? Graham Slee does, I believe, do a nice MM/MC phono stage with selectable mc cartridge loading options, but it costs.

I started my second hifi life with mm and was very happy with the Croft mm phono stage, 2 years on I moved to mc. The answer, a mc transformer that plays into the standard MM phono stage. However, not any old transformer, I looked and waited for a used veritable loading transformer to come on eBay, cost me £200, (worth noting, mc cartridges vary in the loading they work best at). I compared with more expensive 'fixed loading transformers and mc phono stages' there is no comparison.

Since then, my beloved mc transformer simply gets transferred from phono stage to phono stage, one only has to buy cheaper mm phono stages, that is forward planning. As and when and if, I change my mc cartridge, I simply change the loading to suit the new cartridge. Forward planning is good but do it right, going at it half cocked could be even more expensive IMHO . . . ?

CJSF

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RE: Croft Acoustics RIAA or Graham Slee Reflex M

That's a fair point CJSF, altough if truth be told, I cannot see myself going down the MC road any time soon (if at all).

Analogue Works TT1 > Onkyo > B&W CM9

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RE: Croft Acoustics RIAA or Graham Slee Reflex M

Waxy wrote:

That's a fair point CJSF, altough if truth be told, I cannot see myself going down the MC road any time soon (if at all).

I said that too about a Valve amp.......ooops Smile

 

 

Michell / Icon Audio / Kudos

 

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RE: Croft Acoustics RIAA or Graham Slee Reflex M

I'm glad that two post state what I feel and think about importance of a good phono stage. Built in phono stages usually ain't no good, even if the amp was produced by established TT manufacturer (e.g. Roksan) or if the manufacturer of the amp has reputation for quality phono imputs, most of the time, this just isn't true. Rega is an exception to this rule.

I'd say that PhS is even more important than TT. Even good budget TT with decent PhS will outperform hi-end TT with crapy PhS.

Once you have a decent PhS, TT becomes the most important component, than arm.

Cartridge is the least important factor in the chain IMO. Definitely it's the factor one should consider once everything else is sorted - TT with power supply, arm, PhS + amp and speakers.

 

And you don't need a £500 budget to tremendously better an average built in phono stage.

And if you have £500 budget, perhaps you can find something that will sound perfect + give you open options regarding MC in the future.

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RE: Croft Acoustics RIAA or Graham Slee Reflex M

OR just try Rega Brio, if you dare :grin:

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RE: Croft Acoustics RIAA or Graham Slee Reflex M

Waxy wrote:

That's a fair point CJSF, altough if truth be told, I cannot see myself going down the MC road any time soon (if at all).

. . . thats what we all say (said) :? . . . However, my way takes you through in easy stages without being stuck or over spending for nothing? That phono stage is important . . . enjoy. :cheers:

CJSF

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RE: Croft Acoustics RIAA or Graham Slee Reflex M

CJSF wrote:
However, my way takes you through in easy stages without being stuck or over spending for nothing?

 

There's more than one way to skin a cat. :grin:

 

 

 

Analogue Works TT1 > Onkyo > B&W CM9

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RE: Croft Acoustics RIAA or Graham Slee Reflex M

Waxy wrote:

Depending on how much beer I consume tonight, I may just hit that BUY button and take a punt. It's worked so far! Guess I have been lucky...

Taking part in the Slee forum can earn you some discount, so you might not want to be too hasty.

"Inspired" Manticore Mantra TT, Technics SL-7 TT, Graham Slee Reflex M phono preamp.  Cyrus CD8SE.  iMac, Raspberry Pi c/w HiFiBerry Digi c/w Volumio or Rune Audio, Arcam rDAC.  Roksan Kandy LIII amp, Spendor A5 speakers.

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RE: Croft Acoustics RIAA or Graham Slee Reflex M

ifor wrote:

Taking part in the Slee forum can earn you some discount, so you might not want to be too hasty.

 

A certain retailer of GS products is offering 10% off at the mo.... just until Sunday though...

 

I did have a couple of beers last night but opted instead to treat the other half to something she has been coveting for a while. Brownie points coming my way!

Analogue Works TT1 > Onkyo > B&W CM9

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RE: Croft Acoustics RIAA or Graham Slee Reflex M

Waxy wrote:

ifor wrote:

Taking part in the Slee forum can earn you some discount, so you might not want to be too hasty.

 

A certain retailer of GS products is offering 10% off at the mo.... just until Sunday though...

 

I did have a couple of beers last night but opted instead to treat the other half to something she has been coveting for a while. Brownie points coming my way!

it can pay dividends.

"Inspired" Manticore Mantra TT, Technics SL-7 TT, Graham Slee Reflex M phono preamp.  Cyrus CD8SE.  iMac, Raspberry Pi c/w HiFiBerry Digi c/w Volumio or Rune Audio, Arcam rDAC.  Roksan Kandy LIII amp, Spendor A5 speakers.

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RE: Croft Acoustics RIAA or Graham Slee Reflex M

ifor wrote:

Waxy wrote:

ifor wrote:

Taking part in the Slee forum can earn you some discount, so you might not want to be too hasty.

 

A certain retailer of GS products is offering 10% off at the mo.... just until Sunday though...

 

I did have a couple of beers last night but opted instead to treat the other half to something she has been coveting for a while. Brownie points coming my way!

it can pay dividends.

 

Got to say I'm pretty lucky on that count. When a large box from Analogue Works turned up recently, she enquired as to it's contents and on hearing it was a new turntable, she just laughed. Win! :clap:

Analogue Works TT1 > Onkyo > B&W CM9

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RE: Croft Acoustics RIAA or Graham Slee Reflex M

There's a review of the TT1 in the latest issue of HiFi+.  They rated it highly.

"Inspired" Manticore Mantra TT, Technics SL-7 TT, Graham Slee Reflex M phono preamp.  Cyrus CD8SE.  iMac, Raspberry Pi c/w HiFiBerry Digi c/w Volumio or Rune Audio, Arcam rDAC.  Roksan Kandy LIII amp, Spendor A5 speakers.

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