I'd say fill 'yer boots, get the sound you like and don't get too close to anyone scratching away in their 'hair-shirt' of purity. They'll cost you money.
And get you closer to the music, which is what the hobby is all about. Your choice to spend or not.
I should have said "they'll waste your money".
What else do you call the insane cable swapping that goes on in the cause of trying to get the 'right sound' from speakers and amps in your living room? It gets worse when people start adding outboard power supplies and swapping speakers to achieve a sound balance that they can enjoy.
How many 'harsh' or 'bright' amps and speakers (or even cables!) do you see people moaning about? How many times are people told... "Wait until the speakers / amps / cables have run-in." ?
It is sentiments like yours... "by all means use some equalisation if you enjoy that kind of thing, but don't call it hi-fi" (my paraphrasing) ...that makes some people almost feel guilty about using a perfectly legitimate form of adjustment to the tone of their system to make it sound more enjoyable.
I will quote a little bit from that Alan Shaw Harbeth link (that you conveniently left out when quoting me earlier)...
"In short: if your amp has a tone control you are more likely to get the best overall fidelity because you can tune the speaker/room interface to suit you. Tone controls empower you not some marketeer who has decided on your behalf that tone controls are evil."
Here is the link again.
What complete and total nonsense, quoting things that have not been said then arguing against them, pretty silly but all to common.
If you want to reply to my posts, at least read them and respond to what has actually been said.
Perhaps you would like to read my posts and see how much I actually agree with Alan Shaw though no doubt you will choose to 'paraphrase' my language to make it look otherwise.
We do so many shows in a row,
And these towns all look the same,
We just pass the time in our hotel room
And wander 'round backstage,
Till the lights come up, and we hear that crowd,
And we remember why we came.
...I actually agree with Alan Shaw...
I can imagine his relief!
Marantz M-CR603 • Rega R3 loudspeakers • AirPlay • Apple iPad Mini • Apple iPhone 5 • Apple iMac • Apple AirPort Extreme 802.11N • Humax HDR-Fox T2 • Panasonic TX-L32D25B • Sony BDP-S390
... no doubt you will choose to 'paraphrase' my language to make it look otherwise.
What is the essential difference between your actual words....
Firstly if someone wants to muck around with the sound in the belief that it sounds better then that is fine, as I said I am not the 'thought police'.
But as you say it is nothing to with hi-fi ...
...and my paraphrasing?...
"by all means use some equalisation if you enjoy that kind of thing, but don't call it hi-fi"
Not much it seems.
my marantz pm6004 got bass extension positioned at 50Hz so was better suited for my kef's q300 ( added some gentle/ natural bass) while m-cr510 got it at 100Hz so I'm not using it cause it's adds only unpleasant boom.. on some yamaha amps I've seen bass on 20Hz and I wonder what they have been thinking about to put the bass at 20Hz mark !!! which speakers can play this low frequencies? that's why - if needed - computer based eq got far greater control over specific frequencies more precise.. Mac's AU Lab got 32 band.. however - after experimenting with speakers placement recently and some pictures on the wall, rug etc - I found my speakers behave much better to the point where I've got any eq, tone controls etc off.. but still there are recordings poorly made that would benefit from some bass or treble boost but then majority of music I listen too is properly mastered...
still need bigger sound.. but that's another story...
Marantz M-CR510/ Dali Zensor 3/ MacBook
The way I see it is, and I might be wrong as I,m no expert.
Music is produced by the producer twiddling his knobs till he get the sound of the recording how he wants it to sound. And then the album or song is produced.
This may not be how all people like that track to sound but we are not able to do the producing, however tweaking the music to change the levels may increase your enjoyment of the music.
I find that not all music tracks or complete albums have not been produced to a high standard for some reason, which is disappointed when you've paid good money for it.
The end result of the production is fairly irrelevant. Unless we all use the same equipment, and sit in an exact replica of the studio where the music was produced, then we are not going to hear the same thing anyway. It's far more likely that in your untreated living room, with more than likely the speakers a bit too close to a wall, they will boom, and a touch of bass reduction will improve the sound, and bring it more in line with "what was recorded".
A total lack of any tone controls in this instance are less Hi-fi.
“Out beyond ideas of wrong and right, there is a field.
I'll meet you there."
There are two choices in how you wish to listen to your music, either you aim towards neutrality and hope to avoid colouration as much as possible, or you are inclined to prefer a particular type of sound presentation and aim to achieve this. Arguably the only hifi path is the neutral one as it aims to avoid any extraeneous colouration or change in the signal. This is not for everyone though and some prefer the alternative.
It seems that the route of choosing a coloured sound is the one the exhibits the most hypocrisy and snobbery though, as some would frown upon tone controls but be quite happy to change the sound they get by swapping equipment and even cables to achieve it, either way is colouring the sound and changing the source signal, so it would make the most sense to me to use tone controls or EQ to achieve what sound is desired. The statement about 'getting closer to the music' seems like pretentious BS to me, particularly if it involves tweaking away from the original source material. 'Getting closer to the sound you like' would seem a more appropriate and honest statement.
Mac mini > AVI ADM9Ts
So you think 'muck around with the sound' and 'equalisation' mean the same thing? In the context of my other comments?
This is entirely correct.
Judicious use of eq to correct room issues or gently shift the balance to suit the environment is ideal but 'normal' bass and treble controls do this very poorly, hence my entirely positive comments on the Quad system mentioned much earlier in the thread.
But this thread is about the 'enhancement' of the music by 'global' eq and in some cases other processing. Even assuming that it 'improves' some material (highly debateable) it is just as likely to make other material worse. Not a good thing and not hi-fi.
Edited for layout.
I do like to sprinkle a bit of black pepper on my pizza even if it's made by the world's best chef!
My Home Cinema Pioneer KRP 500A, Yamaha RX-V1900, MA Radius R225HD LCR, R90HD rears, AW12 sub, Panasonic BD60, PS3, Boxee Box, Sky HD, Boxee Box, Logitech Harmony One, Logitech PS3 Adapter, Sonos ZP90
Bedroom Samsung UE32C6510, PS3 slim white, Apple TV, Sonos S5, Sonos ZP90, Audioengine 2, Oppo OPDV971H
Miscellaneous: Synology DS212J + 2 X WD Red 2TB drives, WD 1TB NAS, Sonos ZoneBridge, BT HH3 as modem & AirPort Extreme router
.. but you may as well don't like world's best chef pizza because all you ever had was indian shop oily pizza made from not exactly the finest ingredients
But would you smother it in brown source and stlll call it fine dining.........
It's interesting, not sure it;s all good news but it can have a really nice effect on a track. Not sure, maybe my kit is all very neutral and I'm just finding this setting injects a bit more 'life' into the sound (instruments in particular).
Anyone else given it a go, thoughts?
Leema Pulse amp, Spendor A5, REGA DAC, Chord Crimson Plus Interconnect, Chord Rumour 2 speaker cable
If it sound better to you then it sounds better full stop, after all we are the end users and without us our hifi's would never be heard.
Rega RP3 turntable/Naim 5i CD/Naim 5i amp/Neat motive 2/BK sub
MarantzPM6004/MarantzCD6004/Monitor Audio Bronze BX2
Project Box S/B&W P7 headphones
APX's and a bunch of i things
It is a common view, typical of modern times.
Higher quality Hi-Fi equipment is more revealing, so on a poor quality recording I'm sure a little tweaking shouldn't do no harm.
I have a few albums like one recorded by a band called The Amps which can IMO be improved, but as a whole I would agree that a good system needs no adjusting.
So I suppose a tweak or two can make the music more enjoyable and if that makes the OP happy then fair play to him.
© 2014 Haymarket Publishing