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Juzzie Wuzzie's picture
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Television - Clouding - LCD v. Plasma
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Help. I originally had a Philips LCD which suffered from backlight bleed, and was replaced with a Samsung LCD which I've been happy with for about a year. However, I've recently noticed clouding (all over the screen) when watching dark scenes. Two questions:

1. would it make a difference if I upgraded to a plasma television (cost, effort, not an issue)? Television just needs to be a screen - I use no other features.

2. does the fact that I watch in a dark room, without lights on, make a difference? I read somewhere on these forums the suggestion that you should have some low light on when watching LCD screens.

Any and all help appreciated.

JW

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RE: Television - Clouding - LCD v. Plasma

Backlight bleed drove me nuts with the many LCD tvs i had and is the reason i switched to plasma, every LCD i had suffered with the issue to varying degrees.

It is true that watching in complete darkness highlights the issue even more and some low light can definately lessen the effect but not eradicate it, you can try a combination of low light conditions and lowering the backlight setting which should make a difference to the amount of clouding you see but in my experience you can't eradicate the problem entirely unless you switch to plasma or some LED tvs.

So yes switching to plasma would make a difference and see an end to the clouding and trying a combination of low light and turning the backlight down may make a difference to the clouding on your LCD and yes low conditions are best for watching an LCD or any type of tv imo.

Hope that's useful.

Samsung UE55F8000 TV (THX professional calibrated), Dali Zensor 5 7.1 (front presence configuration), Sony BDPS790, Yamaha RX-A2020, Marantz PM6004, Marantz CD6003, Virgin TiVo 1TB, Playstation 4, Playstation 3, WD TV Live, WD My Book World 1TB.

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RE: Television - Clouding - LCD v. Plasma

when you say clouding, do you mean patches of white around the middle of the screen etc or patches at the four corners of the screen creeping in.

Juzzie Wuzzie's picture
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RE: Television - Clouding - LCD v. Plasma

HY - not bleedings - but clouding, starting on the edges (not just corners) and making its way in.  As if England weather was drifting across my screen.  Probably worth looking at plasma for a better result!

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RE: Television - Clouding - LCD v. Plasma

That  sounds like a lot of clouding. Is a dark sceen completely  overtook by the clouding

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RE: Television - Clouding - LCD v. Plasma

The reason i ask is - as stupid as it sounds you can actually work with the clouding to a certain point with the settings including the white balance to balance things out and gradually bring back some black colour tone , by reducing the brightness a bit and not so much the backlight.

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RE: Television - Clouding - LCD v. Plasma

LCD's picture quality is slowly approaching that of plasmas but are not there yet, IMO. There's one BIG problem with many if not all models of plasmas: they make a loud buzzing noise! Maybe not that noticeable with films but I listen to the radio channels & it drives me nuts!

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RE: Television - Clouding - LCD v. Plasma

RE loud buzzing on plasmas...my GT30 has no buzzing atall all you can hear if you get close enough is some very low level humming from the fan but no buzzing.

I did have a GT30 that had extremely loud buzzing that i returned as according to Panasonic it was at an unacceptable level (louder than 1/3rd of normal tv volume) but in general a good quality plasma tv these days doesn't suffer from loud buzzing and in many cases is considered a fault.

It's a part of the review process from what i remember on WHF that they do test for buzzing or any kind of sound with little or no volume to see if a set exhibits any unwanted noise as it's important during quiet moments in movies that you aren't distracted from the film. Of course any sort of buzzing is distracting but in higher end sets i don't think this is an issue any more from the tvs i've auditioned to date but it way well be an issue in cheaper tvs, you get what you pay for imo.

Samsung UE55F8000 TV (THX professional calibrated), Dali Zensor 5 7.1 (front presence configuration), Sony BDPS790, Yamaha RX-A2020, Marantz PM6004, Marantz CD6003, Virgin TiVo 1TB, Playstation 4, Playstation 3, WD TV Live, WD My Book World 1TB.

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Television - Clouding - LCD v. Plasma

Oldboy wrote:

RE loud buzzing on plasmas...my GT30 has no buzzing atall all you can hear if you get close enough is some very low level humming from the fan but no buzzing.

I did have a GT30 that had extremely loud buzzing that i returned as according to Panasonic it was at an unacceptable level (louder than 1/3rd of normal tv volume) but in general a good quality plasma tv these days doesn't suffer from loud buzzing and in many cases is considered a fault.

It's a part of the review process from what i remember on WHF that they do test for buzzing or any kind of sound with little or no volume to see if a set exhibits any unwanted noise as it's important during quiet moments in movies that you aren't distracted from the film. Of course any sort of buzzing is distracting but in higher end sets i don't think this is an issue any more from the tvs i've auditioned to date but it way well be an issue in cheaper tvs, you get what you pay for imo.

It's good news if it's not so much of a problem as I thought it was. I would say my TX-P42V20 buzzes at nothing like a 1/3rd but is audible during quite passages - louder than the fan for instance. I've noticed buzzing being mentioned in a few WHF reviews, so I'm sure the likes of Panasonic are trying to engineer it out. It does remain the weakness of my 2 yr old model though.

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RE: Television - Clouding - LCD v. Plasma

Buzzing aside, plasmas have more advantages than disadvantages. They don't suffer from navy-blue blacks so blacks look black from a far wider range of viewing angles. Some Sony models LCDs DO look superficially sharper but IMO, unnaturally so. Colours also look more natural. Movement is generally smoother though on std def, I do notice visual disturbance behind people's heads, for instance. Viewing angle on plasmas is much better but LCDs are getting better year on year. When you stand up, you don't get the shift in brightness. Plasmas look much better off-axis than any LCD I've seen. As far as "clouding" as the OP calls it - none on my plasma!

They do have some disadvantages: they are heavy, they don't come in sizes below 37" & Logo burn-in remains an issue but I don't think it's permanent or as bad as it used to be. I think they consume more power than LCDs but again, plasmas have improved in this regard. The bezels on plasmas are generally thicker than with some LCDs but even Panasonic are improving this - they did lose the plot a bit regarding aesthetics but have got better. I've also noticed that it's no longer Panasonic making plasmas - more choice so plenty of life left in the technology. Large OLED display technology is still some way off. Finally, I don't think longevity is a problem - don't believe everything salesmen say about plasma sets in Sony Centres!

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RE: Television - Clouding - LCD v. Plasma

Hi,

I have had two LCD, LED/LCD displays. One I kept (in the bedroom the other went back within a week.

Both suffer from clouding and the one i sent back looked like it had a search light shinning out of it just of centre and 1/3rd up from the bottom.

I am now on my second plasma and would not go back to LCD / LED again, even though Panasonic only does the VT range from 50" upwards now.

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RE: Television - Clouding - LCD v. Plasma

busb,

I have to agree with all the points you make and to my eyes plasma still produces the most cinematic image but two tvs i have seen recently come very close (although still don't beat) a plasma image when calibrated correctly, the Sony 46HX853 and Samsung ES8000 LED tvs are very tempting prospects and as close as i've seen to a plasma level of blacks with a very cinematic image.

They still aren't quite there in terms of inky blacks as both still have a very slight tinge to them and lack the outright black detail of a plasma but it's a very close run thing with those two tvs. I won't go back to any sort of backlit technology when it comes to tvs simply because of the issues i've had with clouding and bleed in the past but i think the current generation of LED tvs are catching up now.

My next tv will most likely be another plasma until OLED arrives at a realist consumer level ie under £1500 for a 46inch screen so i guess i will be waiting some time for one of those.

Samsung UE55F8000 TV (THX professional calibrated), Dali Zensor 5 7.1 (front presence configuration), Sony BDPS790, Yamaha RX-A2020, Marantz PM6004, Marantz CD6003, Virgin TiVo 1TB, Playstation 4, Playstation 3, WD TV Live, WD My Book World 1TB.

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RE: Television - Clouding - LCD v. Plasma

Oldboy wrote:

busb,

I have to agree with all the points you make and to my eyes plasma still produces the most cinematic image but two tvs i have seen recently come very close (although still don't beat) a plasma image when calibrated correctly, the Sony 46HX853 and Samsung ES8000 LED tvs are very tempting prospects and as close as i've seen to a plasma level of blacks with a very cinematic image.

They still aren't quite there in terms of inky blacks as both still have a very slight tinge to them and lack the outright black detail of a plasma but it's a very close run thing with those two tvs. I won't go back to any sort of backlit technology when it comes to tvs simply because of the issues i've had with clouding and bleed in the past but i think the current generation of LED tvs are catching up now.

My next tv will most likely be another plasma until OLED arrives at a realist consumer level ie under £1500 for a 46inch screen so i guess i will be waiting some time for one of those.

I agree that LCDs are indeed catching up but still have some way to go. Don't hold your breath for OLED 42" TVs though. They are fine in mobile phones that have a short lifespan before even one's gran wouldn't be seen dead with one but have had reliability issues with the blue LEDs in particular. These issues may get ironed out, LCD technology will get even better or some other technology will get invented.

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