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JulesBadass's picture
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"New" Pioneer PL12d
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Recently rescued the above from the pavement for £15 in a street market. It was a punt, but it appeared solid, nothing was broken (bar the belt) and no cracks or scrapes etc.   

After a clean up of the drum and drive pulley, a new belt saw it burst into life.  I readjusted the counter weight and anti skate according to the manual and initial impressions have far exceeded my expectations. Lovely sound! 

I'm now scouring ebay for a suitable period amplifier to match it with - currently running through a CA Azure 540a which I've never warmed to, with a £20 Maplin phono amp in between - so plenty of scope for improvement....

Aside from this, the one problem with the sound is a slight distortion at the top end. A way to describe it would be that High female vocal "s" sounds can sound like an off tune radio.   Observations on the setup:

1 - Counter weight adjustment. I've possibly set it up a little light at the stylus end. It doesn't skip during play, but a tiny knock will make it do so.

2 - Stylus & Cartridge. Fitted with a Stanton 500, I've no idea of age or condition.  Is this suitable? From what I've googled this seems to be aimed at DJs, more usually being fitted with. Shure M75

Could any of the above be contributing to the treble issues?  I guess if it is a DJ stylus it may well need a load more weight, which I've clearly not given it.

 

Any guidance would be appreciated. 

Al ears's picture
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RE: "New" Pioneer PL12d

Firstly as you have no idea as to history of the cartridge then ditch it and buy something newer to replace it.

Secondly get a cheap stylus balance so you can see exactly what tracking weight you have acting on the stylus.

Hope this helps.

 

Motto: Never pay full price for anything, there is always room to haggle!

Tom Evans Audio Design amplification / Acoustic Zen speakers.

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RE: "New" Pioneer PL12d

Well regarded Turntable.

I believe it has a light mass arm which ideally should be used with high compliance stylii.

Stanton do a lot of different ones so it would be worth you finding out which one exactly is fitted to yours. A common one used is the rugged, conical DJ one. If so, something like a  D71EE .003 x .007mm elliptical (or equivelant) may be a good upgrade.

Remember, matching stylus/cartridge and arm is very important. Get it wrong here and you struggle however, if you have a low compliance (stiffer) stylus in a lightweight arm, adding weight to the headshell or arm can even things out.

Someone mentioned a digital stylus gauge. Good idea, they really are very useful and can save a lot of faffing around but you do need to know the tracking force of your cartridge/stylus combination first. http://www.whathifi.com/forum/turntables-and-lps/cartridgestylus-scales-care-to-be-taken-with-mcs

All the other rules about correct setting up apply, from overhang to VTA etc plus play with antiskate settings too if you experience distortion. Test records/apps such as from Dr Feickert can help here too. http://www.angelsoundaudio.co.uk/ASShop/page119/page42/

I know little about Turntables so others will be able to help more but also head over to vinylengine for usually good advise.

 

regards

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RE: "New" Pioneer PL12d

Thanks for the responses.

AllEars, agreed.   A bit of research seems to suggest  that a reasonable replacement cartridge - in terms of quality, suitability and price... given the age/cost of the deck - is the  is the Audio Technica AT95E.     Any opinions on this guys?       I'd like to maintain a much of the 70s lazy, warm presentaion charactistics as possible.

Drummerman, many thanks for the info - have just bought a set of those scales, silly not to at that price.      I'll read up on setting everything up - given i'll be removing the entire cartridge, i'll need to know what im doing.  I gather I can download and print off various protractors; Baerwald seems to be popular.   Again, any opinions on this?

 

Thanks.

 

 

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RE: "New" Pioneer PL12d

i bought a new audio technica cartridge off the bay for 18 quid to go on my sl1200 works a blooming treat then add a nice 70s pioneer amp and analogue tuner to match you.d have a nice retro set up

TECHNICS SL1200MK2 MARANTZ CR603 PROJECT PHONO STAGE BOWERS AND WILKINS CM1 SILVER ANNIVERSAY SPEAKER CABLE

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RE: "New" Pioneer PL12d

I used to have a Pioneer A-676 reference amp, was big, but it sounded great, and had mm and mc phono stage.

There's a couple on ebay at the moment, one looks a bit over-priced, this one is about what I sold mine for a few years ago, though I think mine was in slightly better condition than this one.

Might be worth a look though. 

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Pioneer-A-676-Stereo-Integrated-Amplifier-Cosmetic-Marks-Used-/251314884529?pt=UK_AudioTVElectronics_HomeAudioHiFi_Amplifiers&hash=item3a8388cfb1

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drummerman's picture
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RE: "New" Pioneer PL12d

JulesBadass wrote:

Thanks for the responses.

AllEars, agreed.   A bit of research seems to suggest  that a reasonable replacement cartridge - in terms of quality, suitability and price... given the age/cost of the deck - is the  is the Audio Technica AT95E.     Any opinions on this guys?       I'd like to maintain a much of the 70s lazy, warm presentaion charactistics as possible.

Drummerman, many thanks for the info - have just bought a set of those scales, silly not to at that price.      I'll read up on setting everything up - given i'll be removing the entire cartridge, i'll need to know what im doing.  I gather I can download and print off various protractors; Baerwald seems to be popular.   Again, any opinions on this?

 

Thanks.

 

 

The AT you mention is best used on light/medium mass arms. You may find it is not an ideal match with your arm.. I believe the AT120 is tracking at a slightly lower force and higher compliance.

Double check but I think the one on your Pioneer is low mass. Its a personal thing but something like the Shure M97xe http://www.shure.co.uk/products/dj_phono/m97xe would probably work well. - I also use an Ortofon VMS20 MKII on a low mass arm with good results.

As to the Baerwald, that is the one most use  (other than Rega users of course Wink so you'll be fine. Just make sure you print exactly to scale.

regards

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RE: "New" Pioneer PL12d

Entirely from memory, but the ATs were always thought to be a bit forward where the Shures were a bit warm, so I'd go with what d man says .

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RE: "New" Pioneer PL12d

Assuming the deck is still fitted with the original tonearm, and there is no reason to believe it is not, the drummermans suggestion of the Shure M97xe is the one I would suggest that would be a fine match for the sound you require.

Regarding an amplifier you can be reasonably sure that most from that era will have a reasonable to very good phono stage already fitted that will take a moving magnet input (it was generally assumed back then that the main source would be a turntable).

 

Motto: Never pay full price for anything, there is always room to haggle!

Tom Evans Audio Design amplification / Acoustic Zen speakers.

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RE: "New" Pioneer PL12d

Thanks for all the responses.  Invaluable advice on the Shure being more suitable for the sound I'm looking for - I've read this elsewhere since my original post as well. 


That said, the M97 is almost four times the price of the AT95, something I have to consider; this is just a vinyl experiment at the minute, I've not got a permanent location for it yet (needs to be out of child reach and not intrusive to Mrs Bs  eyes Lol  Is there another suitable Shure cartridge lower down in the range? Love the spec on that  pioneer amp bigBernard. For some reason I'm fixated on getting a steel fronted amp, preferably with analogue VU meters Smile

 

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RE: "New" Pioneer PL12d

Find an M75ED and fit a nice aftermarket .2 elliptical. That stylus also fits the M75EJ.

You should find one or the other relatively cheaply.

Sound is almost the same as the M97 and it should come in at or under a new AT95.

regards

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RE: "New" Pioneer PL12d

Hi,

Where are you located? I can see the AT at £35 and the Shure at £64, hardly four times.

 

Motto: Never pay full price for anything, there is always room to haggle!

Tom Evans Audio Design amplification / Acoustic Zen speakers.

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RE: "New" Pioneer PL12d

duplicate

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RE: "New" Pioneer PL12d

Thanks chaps. 

 

I'm seeing the AT for around 25 and the Shure no less than 89 in the UK. I did see the Shure for £64 in the USA however. Where was the £64 Shure you saw? 

 

Cheers. 

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RE: "New" Pioneer PL12d

JunoRecords are usually reasonably priced but the Shure is out of stock.

I feel price hikes coming up ...

regards

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RE: "New" Pioneer PL12d

I used to have an AT95E on my Trio KD1033 and then on a Rega and found it worked really well, but inderstand the comments versus the Shure.

 

Surely if you've bought the PL then you have to have an amp from the same period? In which case it has to be a NAD 3020.

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