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RE: Do You Play Lotto Or Euromillions?

BIGBERNARDBRESSLAW wrote:

chebby wrote:

Why do these people agree to the publicity?

And why do they stay in the same house? 

Ooooh, I've won £158 million, but you know what, I'm going to stay in my ex-council semi.  :doh:

If I were happy where I am, I might stay. As it is, I'm in a block of six flats, and it can be a bit like living in my old halls of residence sometimes, so I'd move, or pay everyone here off to leave, then remodel the place. I'm happy with the location, so I wouldn't want to go far.

A nice flat with at least two decent bedrooms, room for A/V kit, a kitchen that isn't just an add-on to my living room (finally)...maybe space for a small gym room.

I play the Euromillions as it's generally worth more and you've gotta be in it to win it. I always play online, and it'd be interesting to know the differences, if any, in the experiences of big winners who played online and those who bought a physical ticket.

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RE: Do You Play Lotto Or Euromillions?

strapped for cash wrote:

I fear you're looking for a row, Chebby. (And making many assumptions about my views in the process.) I'm honestly not seeking an argument. 

I qualified my use of language above, in stating that I wasn't using homogenous terms; and was in many ways being gently provocative. I honestly have some capacity for nuance of thought; and I'd have to be extremely naive and/or stupid to espouse some flawed notion of a British monoculture.

Surely we can have a reasonable discussion without descending into taunts and accusations. As I've said before, it sometimes feels like you're waiting for an excuse to have a go at me. Picking up on a small semantic point, and extrapolating on this to misrepresent my position, feels more than a little unfair.

I'm also unsure why you do this with some frequency. While I don't have a persecution complex, it's hard not to take it personally, despite your claims to have nothing personally against me.

 

I don't accept any of that. Pease read my comments again and explain why I caused such offence.  My comments speculating on your pessimism and cynicism were based entirely on what you had just written about "rabid consumerism and neoliberalism" and what you have often written elsewhere about the state of Britain today.  Although I have some similar concerns, I don't share them to anything lke the same degree.

As for 'culture' and 'society',  I would just rather be part of society first and part of a culture second.

A 'culture' can't legislate for our safety and peace, it can't ensure democracy, it can't build schools or light the streets or decide that minorities will have rights including freedom from persecution and equality uder the law and equality for us all in the voting booth and in political life.  Cultures don't get roads and hospitals built or construct a framework of (largely) consensual taxation to pay for them. Societies do.

Cultural and societal values (despite overlapping) have to remain different things.  I am free to choose my culture, to opt in or out of what pleases me.  I cannot opt out of society or pick and choose my favourite laws and taxes.  Society can protect me from being persecuted for my chosen culture. It won't work the other way around.

Maybe I am the one who is labouring under a misconception about what constitutes a 'society' and a 'culture' (it's entirely possible as I am not politically schooled),  but rather than choose to educate me in how I am getting it wrong,  you have decided I was 'picking a fight'.

 

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RE: Do You Play Lotto Or Euromillions?

BIGBERNARDBRESSLAW wrote:

chebby wrote:

Why do these people agree to the publicity?

And why do they stay in the same house? 

Ooooh, I've won £158 million, but you know what, I'm going to stay in my ex-council semi.  :doh:

If I had won X millions I'd buy the house from the council/landlord and just rent the thing out.

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RE: Do You Play Lotto Or Euromillions?

gel wrote:

I gave up for about a year but have just started again.   I costs me £8 a week to play Lotto and Euromilllions, that is £32 a month!  I think that is a bit crazy but I think I might continue to do it.  

It's definitely more than a bit crazy gel. The chances of winning are ludicrous - even if you spent all £8 a week on just the Lotto (which has far and away the better chance of winning the jackpot), that still means odds of 1,747,977 to 1 as a chance of winning. You're actually more likely to be struck by lightning than winning the lottery.

If on the other hand, you put the £32 in an ISA or some such each month, at the end of the year, you'd be guaranteed to have about £400 (including interest). Each and every year.

 

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RE: Do You Play Lotto Or Euromillions?

strapped for cash wrote:

chebby wrote:

I know Thatcher tried to abolish it,  but surely you mean "everyone in contemporary British society".

Actually, I chose "culture" quite deliberately, as I was thinking about sensibilities.

I guess "culture" and "society" are at least somewhat synonymous and interchangeable.

Both terms now feel too civilised to describe rabid consumerism and neoliberalism. I'll ponder on an alternative. Smile

I can see what you're getting at, "culture" can have various meanings of course, one of which is "the behaviors and beliefs characteristic of a particular social, ethnic, or age group" so by implication this can be good or bad depending upon ones point of view. "Chavism" (for want of a better word) could therefore be a culture surely?

I also happen to think that our perception of Britain today is distorted by the media to a certain extent and while I detest the whole "bling, I want to be famous, WAG" thing, I don't think it's as bad as you seem to be suggesting. It just gets more press.

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RE: Do You Play Lotto Or Euromillions?

professorhat wrote:

gel wrote:

I gave up for about a year but have just started again.   I costs me £8 a week to play Lotto and Euromilllions, that is £32 a month!  I think that is a bit crazy but I think I might continue to do it.  

It's definitely more than a bit crazy gel. The chances of winning are ludicrous - even if you spent all £8 a week on just the Lotto (which has far and away the better chance of winning the jackpot), that still means odds of 1,747,977 to 1 as a chance of winning. You're actually more likely to be struck by lightning than winning the lottery.

If on the other hand, you put the £32 in an ISA or some such each month, at the end of the year, you'd be guaranteed to have about £400 (including interest). Each and every year.

 

4.1% interest on an ISA? Now who's crazy?!

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RE: Do You Play Lotto Or Euromillions?

chebby wrote:

Pease read my comments again and explain why I caused such offence.  My comments speculating on your pessimism and cynicism were based entirely on what you had just written about "rabid consumerism and neoliberalism" and what you have often written elsewhere about the state of Britain today.  Although I have some similar concerns, I don't share them to anything lke the same degree.

Perhaps I'm misinterpreting your post, but as I read it, you're arguing that my use of the term "culture" rather than "society" makes me a misanthrope.

chebby wrote:

Maybe I just don't share your level of pessimism and cynicism about people.

To give context to my posts above (and many others of the same nature), my position isn't informed by indiscriminate hatred of people. Rather, I'm genuinely concerned that the current political direction is both extremely damaging and unsustainable. I say this because I'm worried about what this means for particular sections of "culture," or "society" (or any other noun you feel appropriate). Such a position, I'd argue, is incompatible with misanthropy.

chebby wrote:

If that's a little old-fashioned / idealistic / civilized / inclusive / liberal / pluralist (or whatever) then so be it.

Beyond this, you suggested I was "illiberal." You're familiar with my posts. When have I ever expressed an opinion that could be interpreted as right wing?

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RE: Do You Play Lotto Or Euromillions?

plastic penguin wrote:

BIGBERNARDBRESSLAW wrote:

chebby wrote:

Why do these people agree to the publicity?

And why do they stay in the same house? 

Ooooh, I've won £158 million, but you know what, I'm going to stay in my ex-council semi.  :doh:

If I had won X millions I'd buy the house from the council/landlord and just rent the thing out.

What would be the point? If you've just won £158 million quid why would you be worried about getting another £500 a month?

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RE: Do You Play Lotto Or Euromillions?

BenLaw wrote:

professorhat wrote:

gel wrote:

I gave up for about a year but have just started again.   I costs me £8 a week to play Lotto and Euromilllions, that is £32 a month!  I think that is a bit crazy but I think I might continue to do it.  

It's definitely more than a bit crazy gel. The chances of winning are ludicrous - even if you spent all £8 a week on just the Lotto (which has far and away the better chance of winning the jackpot), that still means odds of 1,747,977 to 1 as a chance of winning. You're actually more likely to be struck by lightning than winning the lottery.

If on the other hand, you put the £32 in an ISA or some such each month, at the end of the year, you'd be guaranteed to have about £400 (including interest). Each and every year.

 

4.1% interest on an ISA? Now who's crazy?!

Wihout any interest, you'd have £384 (in my mind that relates to "about £400"). So even if you only got 2%, that would be nigh on £388.19 with interest.

Quibbling over pounds and pence aside, the point obviously being it's most likely more than you'd ever get "investing" in Lotto tickets.

 

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RE: Do You Play Lotto Or Euromillions?

chebby wrote:

A 'culture' can't legislate for our safety and peace, it can't ensure democracy, it can't build schools or light the streets or decide that minorities will have rights including freedom from persecution and equality uder the law and equality for us all in the voting booth and in political life.  Cultures don't get roads and hospitals built or construct a framework of (largely) consensual taxation to pay for them. Societies do.

Cultural and societal values (despite overlapping) have to remain different things.

To add to the above, I don't understand this disctinction in the same way. Culture and politics are related, while "culture" and "society" are in no way discrete.

Instead, they influence one-another. Political activity and opinion is refracted through culture, while cultural processes feed into political debate and can inform policy.

I think it's more useful to think in terms of exchange rather than trying to separate these terms. I have no issue with you substituting "culture" for "society," if this feels more comfortable. I simply object to being cast as an illiberal misanthrope for daring to use what's in all honesty a pretty innocuous term.

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RE: Do You Play Lotto Or Euromillions?

Strapped, I think we are both basically on the same side but are grappling to find a language to understand each other. We come from different directions.  You are immersed in academic studies of culture and society (especially with regard to media) to a level of rigour I can only boggle at. 

I am from a technical background and my profession is technical, so my interests in histor,y philosophy and culture are non-academic and come from the position of an 'interested layman' or amateur. (Like my hobby, photography, which is neither academic nor professional but a passtime.)

I still think of 'culture' in terms of art, music, dress, language, diet, religion, sport, literature etc. and - to an extent - the values we take from all that and the parts of our identity that all these things inform.

Society (to me) is something 'harder', less nebulous,  to do with the rule of law, community, democracy, a shared consensus on what matters to everyone (regardless of culture) like a health system and education and protection from crime and things like our governance and welfare and our infrastructure.  It relies on most of us adhering to shared societal values and duties and agreeing on the necessity of doing so. When that breaks down it's anarchy and 'curtains' for us all. It doesn't have to be a nationalistist thing or Tory or Socialist or Liberal. We do it, we agree to do it, because the alternatives are too hideous to contemplate.

"Illiberal misanthrope"?  Your words, not mine. The most 'illiberal' (and misanthropic) people I have known however, did come from the left-hand side of politics although I don't sense your politics are as 'hard-core left' as their's were. They could only see people as socio-economic units, classes, masses etc. and would - given no-one to laugh at them - have still described them as 'the proletariat'  given half a chance.

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RE: Do You Play Lotto Or Euromillions?

professorhat wrote:

gel wrote:

I gave up for about a year but have just started again.   I costs me £8 a week to play Lotto and Euromilllions, that is £32 a month!  I think that is a bit crazy but I think I might continue to do it.  

It's definitely more than a bit crazy gel. The chances of winning are ludicrous - even if you spent all £8 a week on just the Lotto (which has far and away the better chance of winning the jackpot), that still means odds of 1,747,977 to 1 as a chance of winning. You're actually more likely to be struck by lightning than winning the lottery.

If on the other hand, you put the £32 in an ISA or some such each month, at the end of the year, you'd be guaranteed to have about £400 (including interest). Each and every year.

 

 

That definitely makes a lot more sense, cheers.   :cheers:   I am definitely thinking of halfing the total I pay out by just doing Friday Euromillions and Saturday Lotto once a week.  That would be £4 a week and £16 a month.   I mean £400 a year also would pay for a new games console, or iPad, or phone and Blu-Ray player.   Smile

 

 

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RE: Do You Play Lotto Or Euromillions?

professorhat wrote:

BenLaw wrote:

professorhat wrote:

gel wrote:

I gave up for about a year but have just started again.   I costs me £8 a week to play Lotto and Euromilllions, that is £32 a month!  I think that is a bit crazy but I think I might continue to do it.  

It's definitely more than a bit crazy gel. The chances of winning are ludicrous - even if you spent all £8 a week on just the Lotto (which has far and away the better chance of winning the jackpot), that still means odds of 1,747,977 to 1 as a chance of winning. You're actually more likely to be struck by lightning than winning the lottery.

If on the other hand, you put the £32 in an ISA or some such each month, at the end of the year, you'd be guaranteed to have about £400 (including interest). Each and every year.

 

4.1% interest on an ISA? Now who's crazy?!

Wihout any interest, you'd have £384 (in my mind that relates to "about £400"). So even if you only got 2%, that would be nigh on £388.19 with interest.

Quibbling over pounds and pence aside, the point obviously being it's most likely more than you'd ever get "investing" in Lotto tickets.

 

 

I know and I wasn't really quibbling, just a topical interest rates related joke. 

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RE: Do You Play Lotto Or Euromillions?

BenLaw wrote:
I know and I wasn't really quibbling, just a topical interest rates related joke.

I just played TAX for 56 points in a game of Words with Friends, I was quite pleased with the topicality of it...

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RE: Do You Play Lotto Or Euromillions?

chebby wrote:

Strapped, I think we are both basically on the same side but are grappling to find a language to understand each other. We come from different directions.

I start from an understanding that all language is polysemic. In this sense, we can endlessly debate a term's meanings, but we'll never arrive at a final definition. Likewise, we can never separate terms such as "culture" and "society" in a definitive sense.

There may be subtle differences between our understandings of the term culture and its applications. This is fine, and perhaps inevitable, given our different professions and experiences. 

chebby wrote:

"Illiberal misanthrope"?  Your words, not mine.

Admittedly I was paraphrasing.

However, you stated that your position may be too liberal for me. You also stated that I have a cynical and pessimistic view of "people." (I do, with regard to certain people, attitudes, and institutions, though this certainly isn't my view of everyone.) 

chebby wrote:

The most 'illiberal' (and misanthropic) people I have known however, did come from the left-hand side of politics although I don't sense your politics are as 'hard-core left' as their's were. They could only see people as socio-economic units, classes, masses etc. and would - given no-one to laugh at them - have still described them as 'the proletariat'  given half a chance.

I don't think such thoughts or phrasing are the preserve of the far left.

In any case, as stated above, I'm honestly not seeking an argument. I simply felt that my words had been twisted in a way that distorted both my contributions to this thread and my political views more generally.

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