20 years ago today James Bulger was murdered

Have been reading the dad's account of what went on over the past few weeks, just awful.

RIP James. my Son was 3 whent this happened It broke our hearts when this happened our hearts went / go out to his Mum and Dad and we still think about them

As awful as this crime was, and obviously it was truly horrific. I do think that two ten year olds committing such an act isn't as awful as when an adult does it.

Adults know better, they know what they are doing, they know that torture and murder is a truly dreadful crime, but they still do it.

10 year old boys, with disturbed backgrounds, maybe (and I do mean maybe) didn't quite understand the full extent of what they were doing. This doesn't mean I think the boys should not have been imprisoned, I actually think they should have been put away for life, but I find the crimes of adults against children even more difficult to comprehend.

I guess we were all shocked by the fact that children could do this to another child, and at the evident breakdown in society. Maybe we blame ourselves for allowing children to grow up so disturbed that they could commit such a heinous act, I don't know. 

It truly was a sad day in British history, but every day a child is murdered is a sad day for this country, and for the world as a whole.

Cannot argue with any of that. The only thing I would add is that murder rates have been coming down for many years and that is something we should be positive about as we remember this terrible event.

Itl's a very emotionally divisive issue this whole area.

I disagree with BBB, in that they should have been jailed for life. They were 10. At that age it is entirely reasonable to say they haven't yet learned right from wrong and deserve a 2nd chance.

On the other hand, if it had been my child, I would be in jail instead, as they would either both be dead, or I would. But again that's an emotional response and one reason that nobody with any emotional attachment to something should be involved in setting the punishments. That needs cold hard logic.

My gut feeling is that their parents, all of them, should have served jail time, and similar for more minor crimes. The town centres across the UK are getting full of juvenile delinquents who need a more guiding hand, but are instead parented by lazy EDITEDs who just want peace and quiet and their offspring out of the way while they can sit and watch "Deal or No Deal" or "I'm a has-been Celebrity get me a new job" and sink a few tins or play Farmville 2 on Facebook.

 

Make parents ultimately responsible for their children's actions and we may get a reversal of the horrible trend we're seeing. As it is, I think we'll see more of the rioting, more anarchy and less and less people willing to become teachers (who for my mind, mostly all deserve a medal).

 

But in the end, that particular tradgedy was pretty much a one off. What of the millions of kids who are dying or being abused in Africa, the Middle East, and even more scarily in the USA who have the highest percentage of child abuse in the Western World?

 

 

 

 

This is an incredibly emotive issue...but...

 

...fraid I can't really agree with that. James Bulger was abducted, tortured (the inquest detailed 42 different injuries), sexually assulted and left on a railway-track to be sliced in two by an on-coming train. My own kids are ten and they sure as heck know that's wrong.

A tiny percentage of people are just simply pure evil in the same way that a tiny percentage of people are saints.

Bulger's killers are demons who shall hopefully rot in hell. I remain frustrated that a tiny proportion of my taxes are paying for those two creatures to live and breathe.

 

Hasn't one of them been released?

One of my friends attended the call to this crime. A lot of the details were withheld because they were just too sickening. They should never be released. Pure evil.

 

If I remember correctly, they were both released when they were 18, with new identities. Vanables has since been re-admitted for downloading and distributing child p*rn. Ironic, seeing that the parole-board thought he was the least likely of the two to reoffend.
Even though Robert Thompson walks and breathes among us, be in no doubt that we're paying dearly to maintain the worldwide injunction protecting his (and Venables') new identity.

It isn't quite so simple as right and wrong. As Gitta Sereny's books on Mary Bell demonstrate, it's possible for certain experiences to warp your understanding of reality and the consequences of your actions even whilst you know those actions are indeed wrong.

A better understanding of the lives of Venables and Thompson may reveal quite a lot, but who knows.

Yes, they were both released (one from Barton Moss, one from Red Bank, both of which are near late relatives of mine, as it goes) around the same time, wirth Venables being returned three years ago due to a breach of his identity - it was when they came to take him in that they found him trying to destroy/remove his hard drive, and you know the rest.

The horse has well and truly bolted regarding Venables' new identity, as of a couple of years ago. That must leave them in a very difficult situation. Still, he also revealed his identity himself at least twice, so they probably won't consider letting him out until they are sure he will not compromise himself again. Could be a very long wait.

Probably turn out that Venables has the most difficulty with mentally coping with his 'burden'.
At the time of the trial, it was reported that of the two, Robert Thompson was the one who showed the least remorse for what they had done.

I cannot believe, no matter what kind of twisted upbringing a child has been subjected to, that by the time it is ten years old it does not know that torturing and killing a two year old toddler is wrong, unless somehow it's living in a world where it's seeing that happen routinely every day and so it considers such behaviour 'normal', which doesn't apply to anyone in England.

Problem is, modern thinking doesn't accept that some people are just fundamentally 'bad'. Someone's got to be to blame. Society. The parents. The schoolteachers. But I truly believe that in a tiny minority of cases, none of those apply. Some people are just born evil. Simple as. No redemption possible.

I'm now 20, making me about the same age as the killers would be. I can't help but think that sending a 10 year old to jail during the most influential time of his life, almost ensures that they will commit some form of crime again. I don't consider myself to be remotely capable of such an act, but I know if I'd have spent the last 10 years of my life in what I assume if a pretty high security facility, I'd definitely be a different person. I mean, between 10 and 20 you find your sexual identity, your place in society (when you are in one) and in general what kind of person you are. None of this can be done in prison. Making me think that a relatively small jail sentence is just a little pointless, either no jail time (and something completely different and radical, no idea what this would be) or a life sentence. As, in my opinion, it just creates more criminals in the current system.

begs the question, what do you do with people who you really think cannot be reformed...

 

You're spot on. My mate worked for the Police at the time and he knew in greater detail the true nature of what happened....... We're talking much, much worse than the widely reported "beaten to death"....... Knowing what I know, I can't see why they should have been released at all....

 

Had they been 5 or 6, I could maybe be swayed by the too young to know right from wrong, but not at 10 years old.

 

Except that by all accounts Thompson may well have been reformed. I guess you never know until you're proved wrong, but if he lives the rest of his life offence free then he was reformed. 

 

What do you do if you think they'll never be reformed? Well some people get whole life sentences - Criegan will get one. And a parole board decides (effectively) whether a lifer has been reformed - although they never say never. Venables is preparing for another parole hearing I believe. 

 

The way the law sees it is that most people have the capacity to reform, and the younger someone is the more chance they have, even where the offences are very bad. The problem here is that the offences are just so twisted.