The Apex Club

Hi MMW, interesting feedback about the Denon!! Im tempted to get a demo now lol. Always looking for ways to get the best sound out of the Apex. I think the Denon receivers partner well with the Apex. They sound warmer to my ears than other receivers i have tested. Im using an Oppo 95 with my Denon AVR A100, i am pretty impressed with the combination. Not sure if anyone on this thread is using an Oppo 95 or 93 with their Apex? Any feedback? Hey Ricky you own an Oppo 93 right?

Btw I watched Gladiator on bluray (the decent quality version) last weekend, and it sounded AMMMAAAZZZING through the Apex!!! One of the best sounding Blurays i own now.

MMW you should really consider investing in 2x subwoofers as well if you can budget for it. I purchased an additional AW12 last year and would never look back - it improved the soundstage significantly. I also added some A10 height speakers to increase the soundstage. Everytime i watch a movie i feel (at least imagine) i'm at an IMAX lol.

Hey gosalh Nice to have you popping in! Hows the little one doing?

Nice that you've gotten the Oppo BDP-95, I have the 93 model which I got in 2011. It's a good one, though I'm not overly impressed. Sometimes it's a little quirky, and I wish it would let me completely separate audio and video in the dual HDMI's, but it's not really the case (not like the Denon 3313 does, anyway). Minor details. It's not a bad player by any means but I do miss the synnergy of the Denon 2500BT I use to have with my receiver. Although that tank of a machine is way too slow to load discs! haha This is why I also suspect that the 4520 with 3313 could be a great combo. Glad you are really enjoying your kick-ass 7.2 Apex! I hear someone else around here just moved along to M&K...

 hahaha j/k

Who might that be?

Hi, Ricky.Do you know why Denon never gets 5 stars from what hi-fi?Because Denon is not  Pioneer and is not Onkyo.To review receiver without Audyssey engaged is insane in my opionion.Because all receivers are only amps without room corection systems..I am very happy with my AVR-4311, it blow Lx-83 away..

Why is not using the onboard EQ "insane"? Doing this tells you a lot about the quality of the basic product itself. Room EQ is an additional product that ensures you're getting the best results from that product in that room, but tells you nothing of how good the actual product is. You'd be surprised at the difference between products when room EQ isn't used....

Just because a product has what is classed as a top notch room EQ onboard, it doesn't mean that the product itself is worth the asking price.

Most people use their receivers with Audyssey ON.So i think, it doesnt matter how it sounds without Audyssey engaged.This is not a stereo amp.

You may have a look how the audio/video equipment can be reviewed( this is about avr-4311, but doesnt matter).You can use google translator if you want   http://www.areadvd.de/hardware/2010/denon_avr_4311.shtml

I think David's comment is a fair point. I used to run my Denon without the processing turned on, different house to where i am now though.

Hi, michael.And you running your Pioneer with mcacc ON Yes?

Yes, I am.

This house is not as cinema friendly as my previous one, and does need some room correction (see the link in my sig).

I do run it in direct mode, so no DSP effects, it is the Dynamic EQ on the Denon I do not like.

I do agree with David that to hear how an amp sounds, listen to it with no processing etc going on.

Then use whatever means to correct the room.

It could definitely be a good idea to test an amp without using the room correction, DSP or other trickery... aswell. Why not? But, I am equally interested in hearing/reading about the amp with those features. When it comes down to it it's simply the end result of what you've got available that's important. And if room correction, EQ, DSP or other trickery works as a benefit due to your room (and taste) together with the amps already existing capabilites and qualities I see no reason for debate.

I myself couldn't manage without Audyssey's Dynamic EQ. Honestly, everything I've tried without it sounds pretty bland to my ears (this is mostly for movies though, music can be a different matter). Apart from my own tests at home I've heard quite a few set-ups now in well treated demo rooms with amps that don't feature Audyssey Dynamic EQ and they've absolutely been ok (Yamaha, Harman Kardon, Pioneer, Rotel, Primare). But as soon as they switch to an amp that has it - *BOOM* - everything falls into place. I experience exactly the same in my home.

I think this is because Dynamic EQ is more than just any old equalizer - it's an automatic loudness feature that very effectively balance the sound from every speaker without sounding artificial or bloated (IMO). It brings out the smallest of detail and engrosses you with a myriad of sound without letting any one speaker "take over". All that at normal listening levels that I, thus far, find hard to replace with anything else. I mean, for example, when I tested the Pioneer SC-LX83 and 85 they came off as terribly front-heavy and a little 'flat' duing movie watching. The surrounds were very subdued. I put the Denon and Dynamic EQ back in place and the difference truly was huge, but not in a distracting way. I think if one likes Dynamic EQ and gets use to it (in the positive sense) it can be difficult switching to something that doesn't have it. In my experience anyway.

Ok, there is What hi-fi deal, to test without Audyssey or with.I think they must test all receivers with the same rules- with correction or without..Then will be the same chances to all brands..But most reviewers test receivers with Room corection systems engaged..for example- http://www.homecinemachoice.com/news/article/denon-avr-4311-review/9994

http://www.hometheater.com/content/anthem-mrx-300-av-receiver-page-2

And in most cases, manufacturer recommends to use room corection system..

That first review hints at what would be better performance for the Denon AV receiver - EQ off - but his room wont let him do it so its obviously not treated.  Therefore the room correction is the secondary option

The Room Correction System is trying to correct for the physics of soundwaves in the room - the soundwaves are still there with EQ - still smearing the sound you should be getting

Take the room away and the correction system is not needed - at the same time the correction system does not to my knowledge take the room away - all it does is reduce or try to boost some of the most extreme effects but at a cost

Take the room away - the system will sound its best Fact! (some subs excempt) - therefore in a treated room Room Correction is not needed as the system is already sounding its best - as in the WHF test room - therefore the EQ system will only make the kit sound worse.

Why does music never sound good EQ'd ...... Then why would a movie sound track sound better EQ'd

Off topic but this is a very good video to watch http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lbLVjHfHahg

My home theater room with the new colors 

paulbroke - that was some great pictures!  I think your HT looks damn cosy and inviting. I especially like the warmth of the room. Now all you need really is a second AW12 subwoofer on the left side there!

Thanks for showing us and making the effort!!

Thanks RickyDeg,

I do not prefer 2nd sub. 1 piece AW12 is strong enough, it is shaking the walls