Paradigm SUB 15, Ken Kreisel 5000 Mark3 subwoofer advice advice needed..

Did anyone take you up on this comparison?

I would be interested in your results/views comparing the Fathoms with the old and new Kreisel subs?

I didn't, because there was no point.  If anyone is stupid enough to even begin to consider that the single 13.5" driver of the F113 is going to compete with the 2x 12" drivers of the DXD12012, then they deserve to waste their money on an inferior product.  SVS use exactly the same drive unit (as the one used in the F113) in their SB13 Ultra and at less than half the price, so why would anyone be stupid enough to pay way over the odds for something that looks good but is easily matched or out-performed by other Subs at a much lower price.  I don't even need to mention a dual stack DXD12012's, at exactly the same price as a single F113, as it is a completely pointless comparison that no one would ever need to make unless they are looking for the perfect example of how 2 Subwoofers can totally annihilate a single Subwoofer at the same price.

What about a single sealed 15"?

It will be down to how good that sealed 15" subwoofer is designed.  There are fors and againsts for both designes.  But now we know the DXD12012 has ben designed seriously well it is going to take a very decent 15" subwoofer to be as good nevermind out perform it.

A dual 12" and a single 15" sub have roughly the same surface area, so shift roughly the same amount of air. Obviously there are many aspects to a sub that will affect it's performance. Take amplifier power for example. Your Sub15 is 1,700w rms. the DXD12012 uses two 375w rms amplifiers. I know you know how the DXD12012 performs

Different sub manufacturers have different goals, and most manufacturers are trying to produce the deepest bass possible, at the highest level possible. It would be understandable to believe that that is what subs are about, but that is like saying that the best speakers are the loudest ones.

Very true. I replayed the scenes we demoed and I know different rooms etc and from memory but I found the following:

The KK is more articulate in the upper mid bass as to be expected and to my ears faster. 

The Sub15 plays deeper and harder. 

They are two fantastic subs that reproduce epic bass in different ways. I would be happy with either but for my £ the Sub15 is the one for me but and a big but a single Sub15 is £3100 plus £99 for the PBK, two DXD 12012's are £4000. If I were purchasing again I would have to seriously consider saving/borrowing more and going for a duo stack!!!

Well, you'll have to resist when you hear a stack of three...

I know haha. 

 unfortunatley John no-one bothered to come and see them all in the flesh and compare them

you have to ask yourself when presented with an opportunity to do this why certain members keep away

we could have another opportunity soon with the new MK Sound THX dual driver subs if anyone is interested

Roughly how many have you sold David? If you don't mind me asking, just wondering how well they are selling since the launch here in the UK?

Why ? what difference does this make to sound or performance. Or are you doing market research ?

Just personally interested as I don't think I would ever be able to afford one brand new.  I would however like to try and maybe pick up at 2nd hand unit at a lower price one day.

Just personally interested as I don't think I would ever be able to afford one brand new.  I would however like to try and maybe pick up at 2nd hand unit at a lower price one day.

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Ok maybe you could put yourself on Frank Harvey's EX demo list as he's going to have 3 going next year (massive assumption on my part). I wouldn't make ideal AV an offer for there one though looks abused   (again massive assumption on my part.)

Those figures aren't really of any interest to the public, but given that it is a completely new brand, and a completely new brand with only two products at the moment, they're going very well, and momentum is picking up. Things will be going very well once there's a couple of speaker ranges to go with the, next month.

Ken really has played a good card with these 2 subs as they can be adapted to or should I say expand once your budget does, it comes in as a reference sub and can then be used to create well, probably one of the best bass LFE system on the market, period!