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RE: Wiring, Nordost or Audioquest way?

SiUK wrote:

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Ok.  So you want words of wisdom?

Still waiting.

 

Quote:
I would be interested to understand how this can possibly be better than a jumper plate

 

You are clearly searching for answers as well then! But until then it doesn't exist...okay. Good job breathing doesn't depend on us believing in the existence of air.

Ah. I see we have a philosopher rather than a scientist. 

How about trying some replacement mains cables? 

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RE: Wiring, Nordost or Audioquest way?

songox wrote:

Since my amp and speaker terminals are easily accesible and its not gonna cost me a cent i have just done a little test. I put both of my speakers out of phase first and yes it sounded terrible no bass, i couldnt tell where the vocalist was inside soundstage and then i put everything as it shoud be just speaker cable the wrong way and indeed it sounded wrong - not as bad as out of phase but still wrong, there was a lack of bass, vocals where coming from far away behind the soundstage not much in seperation between instruments... I double checked it too so pretty sure i heard what i heard.

Songox,

Part of my life was spent designing audio equipment for a well known national broadcaster.  At no stage did we ever detect any directional aspect of copper cable.  It is my belief that you (as with many others, myself included) are the subject of suggestion bias.  If however you have detected this hitherto undetected property, I would suggest you contact the following organisation:

http://www.nobelprize.org/nomination/physics/index.html

Let us know how it goes.

 

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RE: Wiring, Nordost or Audioquest way?

SiUK wrote:

so basically you cannot explain it therefore it does not exist... hmmm

I am not surprised by what you heard, and IME replacing the plates and experimenting with wiring configurations can certainly be beneficial. Don't be talked out of what you are clearly hearing.

"We should no more let numbers define audio quality than we should let chemical analysis be the arbiter of fine wines."  Nelson Pass

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RE: Wiring, Nordost or Audioquest way?

CnoEvil wrote:

SiUK wrote:

so basically you cannot explain it therefore it does not exist... hmmm

I am not surprised by what you heard, and IME replacing the plates and experimenting with wiring configurations can certainly be beneficial. Don't be talked out of what you are clearly hearing.

I agree.  If you can hear it then do it.  I think it's all in your head but the sound ends up in your head too so why not.

Chris

Marantz PM8005 / SA8005 / KEF R700s / AKG K702

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RE: Wiring, Nordost or Audioquest way?

CnoEvil wrote:

SiUK wrote:

so basically you cannot explain it therefore it does not exist... hmmm

I am not surprised by what you heard, and IME replacing the plates and experimenting with wiring configurations can certainly be beneficial. Don't be talked out of what you are clearly hearing.

You are of course quite at liberty to believe whatever you like - even in the absence of any scientific proof. 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Argument_from_ignorance

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RE: Wiring, Nordost or Audioquest way?

andyjm wrote:

You are of course quite at liberty to believe whatever you like - even in the absence of any scientific proof. 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Argument_from_ignorance

Oh well; it looks like I'm going to have to stop hearing what I'm hearing, until science catches up.  :shifty:

"We should no more let numbers define audio quality than we should let chemical analysis be the arbiter of fine wines."  Nelson Pass

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RE: Wiring, Nordost or Audioquest way?

Covenanter wrote:

CnoEvil wrote:

SiUK wrote:

so basically you cannot explain it therefore it does not exist... hmmm

I am not surprised by what you heard, and IME replacing the plates and experimenting with wiring configurations can certainly be beneficial. Don't be talked out of what you are clearly hearing.

I agree.  If you can hear it then do it.  I think it's all in your head but the sound ends up in your head too so why not.

Chris

I think I must be Telepathetic....but I like it that way. The Dark Side is where it's at.  :twisted:

"We should no more let numbers define audio quality than we should let chemical analysis be the arbiter of fine wines."  Nelson Pass

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RE: Wiring, Nordost or Audioquest way?

Hello andyjm

I am not particulary offended (or surprised) by the trite efforts to ridicule here; unsophisticated derision is par for the course on open forums in my experience. Nonetheless, those that snipe incredulously at others because they do not themselves understand or believe what is being said rather expose themselves and their own ignorance, not the other way around.

Being a natural sceptic I quite understand the position that the ardent unbelievers here are taking, although I'm patently not as religiously opposed to the possibility of there being an explanation as some are here. In fact, based on some of the responses so far it kind of makes me glad that I'm being lumped in with the 'loopy fruit group'; well at least it would seem that there I am in good, percipient company.

I am the first to accept that we are all too easily fooled when it comes to our own senses. In fact, I consider that every day. But condescending snipes and pseudo explanations from 'non believing contributors' who clearly know a little but perhaps not as much as they'd like - and rigidly ahere to their own narrow, confounded understanding - don't contribute towards an explanation or further understanding, they just clarify their own position.

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RE: Wiring, Nordost or Audioquest way?

SiUK wrote:

Hello andyjm

I am not particulary offended (or surprised) by the trite efforts to ridicule here; unsophisticated derision is par for the course on open forums in my experience. Nonetheless, those that snipe incredulously at others because they do not themselves understand or believe what is being said rather expose themselves and their own ignorance, not the other way around.

Being a natural sceptic I quite understand the position that the ardent unbelievers here are taking, although I'm patently not as religiously opposed to the possibility of there being an explanation as some are here. In fact, based on some of the responses so far it kind of makes me glad that I'm being lumped in with the 'loopy fruit group'; well at least it would seem that there I am in good, percipient company.

I am the first to accept that we are all too easily fooled when it comes to our own senses. In fact, I consider that every day. But condescending snipes and pseudo explanations from 'non believing contributors' who clearly know a little but perhaps not as much as they'd like - and rigidly ahere to their own narrow, confounded understanding - don't contribute towards an explanation or further understanding, they just clarify their own position.

SiUK,

There is a never ending stream of posters on this forum with little or no technical understanding who have "heard a difference" and in spite of a large body of knowledge available on the web about the unreliability of human perception and a complete lack of any technical support for their viewpoint assume that somehow they must be right.  Your jumper / wiring example is a case in point.

I have explained in my post above why, a) flat plate jumpers are better than cables and spades, and b) the nordest / audioquest connection approach makes no difference.

Perhaps you could explain why I have got it wrong?  

 

 

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RE: Wiring, Nordost or Audioquest way?

I myself am one of the boring people in that I deal in facts and scientific proof, not fiction, and following this principal there is no evidence of any of the differences mentioned, (I have certainly never heard any in a blind test) but if somebody can prove that the above mentioned changes actually make a difference in a repeatable monitored and documented scientific test then I will certainly accept it, however as no one anywhere in the world has yet been able to do this I will stay as I am.

Bill

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RE: Wiring, Nordost or Audioquest way?

So if it's all in the head can the non-believers brain not tell him that there is no difference between cables? If a non-believer is so sceptical about it plus there is no scientific proof would their brain not lie to them if it actually sounded different! Placebo effect should work both ways! We all got brain!

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RE: Wiring, Nordost or Audioquest way?

songox wrote:

So if it's all in the head can the non-believers brain not tell him that there is no difference between cables? If a non-believer is so sceptical about it plus there is no scientific proof would their brain not lie to them if it actually sounded different! Placebo effect should work both ways! We all got brain!

You are completely correct, which is why it must be a repeatable monitored and documented scientific test, so that all the variables you mention are removed.

Bill

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I posted a link about

I posted a link about directional cables on another thread. It was from a cable manufacturer and they didn't believe in directional cables but were happy to sell them. What they found was that cables all cut from the same reel were thought to be directional in different directions and in a purely random fashion by "believers". I thought that was particularly telling.
Chris

Marantz PM8005 / SA8005 / KEF R700s / AKG K702

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RE: Wiring, Nordost or Audioquest way?

That's akin to selective hearing.

 

There's a really good article by Audioquest called 'Cable Theory. Theory vs Evidence'. I read it some time ago and found it to be a very balanced and intelligent examination of this topic considering their position. But they design and sell cables so what would they know?

 

I tend not to read the religious-style rants as they are invariably circular and you end up just going round and round someone else's prejudices. ..fruitlessly. Balanced examination does it for me.

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RE: Wiring, Nordost or Audioquest way?

SiUK wrote:

 But they design and sell cables so what would they know?

 

they'd know that they will say anything to sell more cables.  It's called advertising.

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