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davedotco's picture
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RE: Warm, musical budget integrated amp. Which?

Blackdawn wrote:

What about the Marantz 600* ? They seem to win nearly every award for budget amps. I would have a difficulty picking between the Pioneer A30, Marantz and NAD C316BEE.

That is because the capability of the three amplifiers mentioned is not exceptional, sure they sound nice enough, goes loud enough without obvious distress but are otherwise not that special. They all present the sound a little differently, a little more bass here, a little less there etc, etc, yet their ability to draw you into the music is severely limited. This is of course only as I see it, others have different views.

Better amplifiers such as the Creek and the Croft earn their place by their ability to reveal more of the music, they give greater insight and are more engaging, something that, for me, the lesser amplifiers do not do.

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RE: Warm, musical budget integrated amp. Which?

davedotco wrote:

Were you in the UK (you're not are you?) I would recommend that you have a good rummage down the back of the sofa and come up with a bit more cash and get the £850 Croft integrated.

Looking at the OP's list I am guessing his amp budget is about £150 - £250.

Have you ever met anyone who had between £600 and £700   'down the back of the sofa'?

Let's keep it real.

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RE: Warm, musical budget integrated amp. Which?

chebby wrote:

davedotco wrote:

Were you in the UK (you're not are you?) I would recommend that you have a good rummage down the back of the sofa and come up with a bit more cash and get the £850 Croft integrated.

Looking at the OP's list I am guessing his amp budget is about £150 - £250.

Have you ever met anyone who had between £600 and £700   'down the back of the sofa'?

Let's keep it real.

Exactly what I was thinking Chebby. 

Rega RP3/Elys 2 - Graham Slee Gram Amp 1 - Rotel RCD965BX - Exposure 1010 amp - Dynaudio DM2/6 - Chord Co. Chameleon VEE3/Rumour 2 - Musical Fidelity V90-HPA - Sennheiser HD595

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RE: Warm, musical budget integrated amp. Which?

davedotco wrote:
Better amplifiers such as the Creek and the Croft earn their place by their ability to reveal more of the music, they give greater insight and are more engaging, something that, for me, the lesser amplifiers do not do.

I have now owned the Pioneer A-30 for some time now and I still enjoy it a lot. I paid 249 euros for it.

The Creek evolution 50A for example will cost me 899 euros. The creek may be better (it should be) but it's way more expensive  Wink

Also.........not every amp that's more expensive may be your 'taste'..............I owned a Roksan K2 once.........could not live with the clinical sound it gave.......so expensive is not always better.

 

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RE: Warm, musical budget integrated amp. Which?

matthewpiano wrote:

chebby wrote:

davedotco wrote:

Were you in the UK (you're not are you?) I would recommend that you have a good rummage down the back of the sofa and come up with a bit more cash and get the £850 Croft integrated.

Looking at the OP's list I am guessing his amp budget is about £150 - £250.

Have you ever met anyone who had between £600 and £700   'down the back of the sofa'?

Let's keep it real.

Exactly what I was thinking Chebby. 

I assumed the amps in question were a little more expensive than that, my fault entirely..... :doh:

It is clearly a big (bigger than I thought) leap in cost but it does address the OP's requirements rather better than many of the other suggestions.

'Down the back of the sofa' is a family expression we use all the time, 're-organising your financial situation to release some extra funds' does not have the same ring too it.

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RE: Warm, musical budget integrated amp. Which?

Cypher wrote:

davedotco wrote:
Better amplifiers such as the Creek and the Croft earn their place by their ability to reveal more of the music, they give greater insight and are more engaging, something that, for me, the lesser amplifiers do not do.

I have now owned the Pioneer A-30 for some time now and I still enjoy it a lot. I paid 249 euros for it.

The Creek evolution 50A for example will cost me 899 euros. The creek may be better (it should be) but it's way more expensive  Wink

Also.........not every amp that's more expensive may be your 'taste'..............I owned a Roksan K2 once.........could not live with the clinical sound it gave.......so expensive is not always better.

 

 

I did not find the RK K2 clinical, if anything it was the other way, which speakers did you use?

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RE: Warm, musical budget integrated amp. Which?

Cypher wrote:

davedotco wrote:
Better amplifiers such as the Creek and the Croft earn their place by their ability to reveal more of the music, they give greater insight and are more engaging, something that, for me, the lesser amplifiers do not do.

I have now owned the Pioneer A-30 for some time now and I still enjoy it a lot. I paid 249 euros for it.

The Creek evolution 50A for example will cost me 899 euros. The creek may be better (it should be) but it's way more expensive  Wink

Also.........not every amp that's more expensive may be your 'taste'..............I owned a Roksan K2 once.........could not live with the clinical sound it gave.......so expensive is not always better.

This is the essence of choice in hi-fi.

I can produce specifications and other details that show the Creek is a superior amplifier and in a well conducted test I would guess that most people would hear that superiority, but of course that is not the whole story.

The question is whether the difference is worth the cost to you, that is pivotal. 

I have my views which are perhaps a bit off the mainstream, but I give them and try hard to explain how I got to them. Personally I think the Creek is outstanding value, primarily for the level of 'engagement' that it gives me (see above). For me this makes the price difference very worthwhile, for others this is not the case.

One of the factors that convince me of the value of the Creek (and the Croft) is that in order to get a worthwhile improvement I find I need to go to models like the entry level Electros and Sugdens, quite a lot more money.

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RE: Warm, musical budget integrated amp. Which?

 Sorry, my budget is up to 400 euro, so Creek is not for me. Marantz 600x series is over my budget. I do not want "the super perfect amp" for this price.

I looking for a budget amp wich has no clinical sound, with "rounded of " treble, so listenable without fatique. My speaker has a weak tendency toward harsh treble sound at moderate/high volume levels.

My Arcam was a good amp with silky treble, but now it has some problems, is not very reliable

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RE: Warm, musical budget integrated amp. Which?

Tibor wrote:

 Sorry, my budget is up to 400 euro, so Creek is not for me. Marantz 600x series is over my budget. I do not want "the super perfect amp" for this price.

I looking for a budget amp wich has no clinical sound, with "rounded of " treble, so listenable without fatique. My speaker has a weak tendency toward harsh treble sound at moderate/high volume levels.

My Arcam was a good amp with silky treble, but now it has some problems, is not very reliable

Buy an amplifier with tone controls and use them.

It is most likely that the 'harsh treble sound' is an amplifier issue, this is the classic symptom of an amplifier running out of power or having difficulty driving the speaker for other reasons.

You need to be aware that €400 will not buy you a new modern amplifier that is as good as your old Arcam, even more true if the Arcam style is to your liking.

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RE: Warm, musical budget integrated amp. Which?

Tibor wrote:

 Sorry, my budget is up to 400 euro, so Creek is not for me. Marantz 600x series is over my budget. I do not want "the super perfect amp" for this price.

I looking for a budget amp wich has no clinical sound, with "rounded of " treble, so listenable without fatique. My speaker has a weak tendency toward harsh treble sound at moderate/high volume levels.

My Arcam was a good amp with silky treble, but now it has some problems, is not very reliable

I would definitely try the Pioneer A-30 and/or Denon PMA-520AE amps. But please listen to them first if you can...........everyone has different ears  Wink

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RE: Warm, musical budget integrated amp. Which?

Tibor wrote:

 Sorry, my budget is up to 400 euro, so Creek is not for me. Marantz 600x series is over my budget. I do not want "the super perfect amp" for this price.

I looking for a budget amp wich has no clinical sound, with "rounded of " treble, so listenable without fatique. My speaker has a weak tendency toward harsh treble sound at moderate/high volume levels.

My Arcam was a good amp with silky treble, but now it has some problems, is not very reliable

 

Marantz is £299 here, so how much is it where you are?

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RE: Warm, musical budget integrated amp. Which?

Looks like Pioneer will be my choice, the price is very good also.I can not listen the Denon, because there is not dealer around me with Denon amps

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RE: Warm, musical budget integrated amp. Which?

Maranty PM 6005 costs over 500 euro

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RE: Warm, musical budget integrated amp. Which?

davedotco wrote:

Tibor wrote:

 Sorry, my budget is up to 400 euro, so Creek is not for me. Marantz 600x series is over my budget. I do not want "the super perfect amp" for this price.

I looking for a budget amp wich has no clinical sound, with "rounded of " treble, so listenable without fatique. My speaker has a weak tendency toward harsh treble sound at moderate/high volume levels.

My Arcam was a good amp with silky treble, but now it has some problems, is not very reliable

Buy an amplifier with tone controls and use them.

It is most likely that the 'harsh treble sound' is an amplifier issue, this is the classic symptom of an amplifier running out of power or having difficulty driving the speaker for other reasons.

You need to be aware that €400 will not buy you a new modern amplifier that is as good as your old Arcam, even more true if the Arcam style is to your liking.

Yes, the problem is that I have to replace my loved Arcam (became inreliable), I looking for similar amp
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RE: Warm, musical budget integrated amp. Which?

Recently on another thread on the forum a member listened to the new Creek amp and found his old Denon budget amp to sound better, so more expensive doesn't always mean better. Stick with the ones in your original list, I'm sure you will be happy. If your set on getting a pretty identical sound to the one you already have, best bet is to go for a near identical second-hand Arcam.

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