17 posts / 0 new
Last post
coyoteblue56's picture
Offline
Last seen: 1 year 4 months ago
Joined: 16/06/2013 - 20:04
Posts: 3
Pro-ject Debut Carbon hum when record plays
English

I just bought a Project Debut Carbon and find that there's a hum when records play. I can only hear it between songs. When I take the stylus off the record the hum stops. I checked for connections on the cartridge, and all other connections from turntable to amp. It sort of sounds like 60hz hum, but then why only when a record's being played. There's no hum other than when a record's played. I'd appreciate any suggestions for how to get rid of this hum.

Al ears's picture
Offline
Last seen: 2 days 12 hours ago
Joined: 23/11/2008 - 19:20
Posts: 3200
RE: Pro-ject Debut Carbon hum when record plays

Is ther an h wire coming from your Debut Carbon? I don't know the deck but probably all hum problems are down to earthing.

If you have an earth wire from deck to amp then try disconnecting it.

 

Motto: Never pay full price for anything, there is always room to haggle!

Tom Evans Audio Design amplification / Acoustic Zen speakers.

sthomas048's picture
Offline
Last seen: 9 months 3 weeks ago
Joined: 23/05/2009 - 14:29
Posts: 323
RE: Pro-ject Debut Carbon hum when record plays

I have had hum issues with my Pro-Ject deck too. Mine hums all the time ! But when playing a record it becomes harder to hear so I live with it. Sorry I dont have a solution. Ive tried everything.

BIGBERNARDBRESSLAW's picture
Offline
Last seen: 5 hours 22 min ago
Joined: 20/10/2010 - 19:33
Posts: 5622
RE: Pro-ject Debut Carbon hum when record plays

I've never had an problem with this on my Debut III, so I think it must be an earthing issue.

Have you tried either connecting, or dis-connecting the earth wire, or connecting in a different way?

Sorry to state the obvious, but it's either that, or a fault with your turntables.

 

Lounge: Panasonic TX-P50GT50 / Yamaha RX-A2020 / Panasonic DMP-BDT110 / Dali Zensor 3 / Dali Zensor Vokal / Mordaunt Short MS20i Pearl Edition / Roksan Radius 5.2 / WDTV My Book Live / Seagate Expansion / Sky HD Box 

coyoteblue56's picture
Offline
Last seen: 1 year 4 months ago
Joined: 16/06/2013 - 20:04
Posts: 3
RE: Pro-ject Debut Carbon hum when record plays

Thanks for the comments.. I'll fiddle with it a bit.

davedotco's picture
Offline
Last seen: 14 hours 41 min ago
Joined: 24/04/2013 - 10:02
Posts: 3556
RE: Pro-ject Debut Carbon hum when record plays

Earthing a turntable can be difficult, particularly if you do not know what you are doing.

Turntable earthing requires that each part of the player is connected to ground once and once only, the turntable, specifically the motor is earthed via the mains connection and is normally not an issue. The arm is usually earthed via a separate earth lead, though on some players it is connected to the screen on one of the channels of the phono lead. The cartridge is then earthier via the screens of the phono leads.

Problems can arise when parts of the player are inadvertently earthed twice, ie a metal bodied cartridge may be earthed by it's physical connection to the arm and by connection via the screened cable to the amplifier, sometimes this is obvious, as when an external link can be seen connecting the metal of the cartridge body to one of the pins on the cartridge. Sometimes these links are internal or accidental and you can't see them, more difficult.

Other issues may arise from the design of the amplifier, in many modern designs the electronics are isolated from the chassis and 'floats', in others the electronics are earthed to the chassis of the amplifier and then to the mains. It might be possible to have the arm connected to the chassis ground but the ground on the cartridge connected to the 'floating' electronics,hence hum.

The issue needs to be tackled in a methodical manner by someone who knows what they are doing, often the manufacturer/distributer will not have te range of experience to be able to help, this is one for a competent dealer if you are lucky enough to know one.

coyoteblue56's picture
Offline
Last seen: 1 year 4 months ago
Joined: 16/06/2013 - 20:04
Posts: 3
RE: Pro-ject Debut Carbon hum when record plays

I loosened the screws on the motor mount and fiddled a bit and did reduce the hum. Odd that now there's nothing in one speaker and a slight hum in the other.  I'll play around some more and see if I can minimize entirely.  At one point I held my screwdriver to one of the screws and the hum disappeared entirely.  Then it came back so that touching the screw made no difference. 

BIGBERNARDBRESSLAW's picture
Offline
Last seen: 5 hours 22 min ago
Joined: 20/10/2010 - 19:33
Posts: 5622
RE: Pro-ject Debut Carbon hum when record plays

davedotco wrote:

Earthing a turntable can be difficult, particularly if you do not know what you are doing.

Turntable earthing requires that each part of the player is connected to ground once and once only, the turntable, specifically the motor is earthed via the mains connection and is normally not an issue. The arm is usually earthed via a separate earth lead, though on some players it is connected to the screen on one of the channels of the phono lead. The cartridge is then earthier via the screens of the phono leads.

Problems can arise when parts of the player are inadvertently earthed twice, ie a metal bodied cartridge may be earthed by it's physical connection to the arm and by connection via the screened cable to the amplifier, sometimes this is obvious, as when an external link can be seen connecting the metal of the cartridge body to one of the pins on the cartridge. Sometimes these links are internal or accidental and you can't see them, more difficult.

Other issues may arise from the design of the amplifier, in many modern designs the electronics are isolated from the chassis and 'floats', in others the electronics are earthed to the chassis of the amplifier and then to the mains. It might be possible to have the arm connected to the chassis ground but the ground on the cartridge connected to the 'floating' electronics,hence hum.

The issue needs to be tackled in a methodical manner by someone who knows what they are doing, often the manufacturer/distributer will not have te range of experience to be able to help, this is one for a competent dealer if you are lucky enough to know one.

Now that's what I meant to say. :grin:

Lounge: Panasonic TX-P50GT50 / Yamaha RX-A2020 / Panasonic DMP-BDT110 / Dali Zensor 3 / Dali Zensor Vokal / Mordaunt Short MS20i Pearl Edition / Roksan Radius 5.2 / WDTV My Book Live / Seagate Expansion / Sky HD Box 

TrevC's picture
Offline
Last seen: 1 month 2 weeks ago
Joined: 12/06/2013 - 10:07
Posts: 761
RE: Pro-ject Debut Carbon hum when record plays

if it only occurs with the record actually playing position the arm on the record with the record stopped. If there's no hum it's motor vibration transmitted through the turntable. Take it back and complain.

TrevC's picture
Offline
Last seen: 1 month 2 weeks ago
Joined: 12/06/2013 - 10:07
Posts: 761
RE: Pro-ject Debut Carbon hum when record plays

BIGBERNARDBRESSLAW wrote:

davedotco wrote:

Earthing a turntable can be difficult, particularly if you do not know what you are doing.

Turntable earthing requires that each part of the player is connected to ground once and once only, the turntable, specifically the motor is earthed via the mains connection and is normally not an issue. The arm is usually earthed via a separate earth lead, though on some players it is connected to the screen on one of the channels of the phono lead. The cartridge is then earthier via the screens of the phono leads.

Problems can arise when parts of the player are inadvertently earthed twice, ie a metal bodied cartridge may be earthed by it's physical connection to the arm and by connection via the screened cable to the amplifier, sometimes this is obvious, as when an external link can be seen connecting the metal of the cartridge body to one of the pins on the cartridge. Sometimes these links are internal or accidental and you can't see them, more difficult.

Other issues may arise from the design of the amplifier, in many modern designs the electronics are isolated from the chassis and 'floats', in others the electronics are earthed to the chassis of the amplifier and then to the mains. It might be possible to have the arm connected to the chassis ground but the ground on the cartridge connected to the 'floating' electronics,hence hum.

The issue needs to be tackled in a methodical manner by someone who knows what they are doing, often the manufacturer/distributer will not have te range of experience to be able to help, this is one for a competent dealer if you are lucky enough to know one.

Now that's what I meant to say. :grin:

 

If it only occurs when the stylus hits the record it can't be an earthing issue.

davedotco's picture
Offline
Last seen: 14 hours 41 min ago
Joined: 24/04/2013 - 10:02
Posts: 3556
RE: Pro-ject Debut Carbon hum when record plays

TrevC wrote:

BIGBERNARDBRESSLAW wrote:

davedotco wrote:

Earthing a turntable can be difficult, particularly if you do not know what you are doing.

Turntable earthing requires that each part of the player is connected to ground once and once only, the turntable, specifically the motor is earthed via the mains connection and is normally not an issue. The arm is usually earthed via a separate earth lead, though on some players it is connected to the screen on one of the channels of the phono lead. The cartridge is then earthier via the screens of the phono leads.

Problems can arise when parts of the player are inadvertently earthed twice, ie a metal bodied cartridge may be earthed by it's physical connection to the arm and by connection via the screened cable to the amplifier, sometimes this is obvious, as when an external link can be seen connecting the metal of the cartridge body to one of the pins on the cartridge. Sometimes these links are internal or accidental and you can't see them, more difficult.

Other issues may arise from the design of the amplifier, in many modern designs the electronics are isolated from the chassis and 'floats', in others the electronics are earthed to the chassis of the amplifier and then to the mains. It might be possible to have the arm connected to the chassis ground but the ground on the cartridge connected to the 'floating' electronics,hence hum.

The issue needs to be tackled in a methodical manner by someone who knows what they are doing, often the manufacturer/distributer will not have te range of experience to be able to help, this is one for a competent dealer if you are lucky enough to know one.

Now that's what I meant to say. :grin:

 

If it only occurs when the stylus hits the record it can't be an earthing issue.

Not entirely true, getting the cartridge close to the motor, when playing a record for example, may induce hum in an incorrectly earthed cartridge.

However if the noise is only present when actually playing a record and dissapears when the motor is switched off and the stylus placed on a stationary record then it is almost certainly motor noise.

However in a later post the OP found that the noise was only in one channel in which case he needs to read my earlier post more carefully.

Secondly, if the hum dissapears when touching a part of the player with a screwdriver, then the next thing to try is to run an earth lead to that point from a known ground.

TrevC's picture
Offline
Last seen: 1 month 2 weeks ago
Joined: 12/06/2013 - 10:07
Posts: 761
RE: Pro-ject Debut Carbon hum when record plays

davedotco wrote:

TrevC wrote:

BIGBERNARDBRESSLAW wrote:

davedotco wrote:

Earthing a turntable can be difficult, particularly if you do not know what you are doing.

Turntable earthing requires that each part of the player is connected to ground once and once only, the turntable, specifically the motor is earthed via the mains connection and is normally not an issue. The arm is usually earthed via a separate earth lead, though on some players it is connected to the screen on one of the channels of the phono lead. The cartridge is then earthier via the screens of the phono leads.

Problems can arise when parts of the player are inadvertently earthed twice, ie a metal bodied cartridge may be earthed by it's physical connection to the arm and by connection via the screened cable to the amplifier, sometimes this is obvious, as when an external link can be seen connecting the metal of the cartridge body to one of the pins on the cartridge. Sometimes these links are internal or accidental and you can't see them, more difficult.

Other issues may arise from the design of the amplifier, in many modern designs the electronics are isolated from the chassis and 'floats', in others the electronics are earthed to the chassis of the amplifier and then to the mains. It might be possible to have the arm connected to the chassis ground but the ground on the cartridge connected to the 'floating' electronics,hence hum.

The issue needs to be tackled in a methodical manner by someone who knows what they are doing, often the manufacturer/distributer will not have te range of experience to be able to help, this is one for a competent dealer if you are lucky enough to know one.

Now that's what I meant to say. :grin:

 

If it only occurs when the stylus hits the record it can't be an earthing issue.

Not entirely true, getting the cartridge close to the motor, when playing a record for example, may induce hum in an incorrectly earthed cartridge.

Which is why i said "hits the record"  :roll:

davedotco's picture
Offline
Last seen: 14 hours 41 min ago
Joined: 24/04/2013 - 10:02
Posts: 3556
RE: Pro-ject Debut Carbon hum when record plays

TrevC wrote:

davedotco wrote:

TrevC wrote:

BIGBERNARDBRESSLAW wrote:

davedotco wrote:

Earthing a turntable can be difficult, particularly if you do not know what you are doing.

Turntable earthing requires that each part of the player is connected to ground once and once only, the turntable, specifically the motor is earthed via the mains connection and is normally not an issue. The arm is usually earthed via a separate earth lead, though on some players it is connected to the screen on one of the channels of the phono lead. The cartridge is then earthier via the screens of the phono leads.

Problems can arise when parts of the player are inadvertently earthed twice, ie a metal bodied cartridge may be earthed by it's physical connection to the arm and by connection via the screened cable to the amplifier, sometimes this is obvious, as when an external link can be seen connecting the metal of the cartridge body to one of the pins on the cartridge. Sometimes these links are internal or accidental and you can't see them, more difficult.

Other issues may arise from the design of the amplifier, in many modern designs the electronics are isolated from the chassis and 'floats', in others the electronics are earthed to the chassis of the amplifier and then to the mains. It might be possible to have the arm connected to the chassis ground but the ground on the cartridge connected to the 'floating' electronics,hence hum.

The issue needs to be tackled in a methodical manner by someone who knows what they are doing, often the manufacturer/distributer will not have te range of experience to be able to help, this is one for a competent dealer if you are lucky enough to know one.

Now that's what I meant to say. :grin:

 

If it only occurs when the stylus hits the record it can't be an earthing issue.

Not entirely true, getting the cartridge close to the motor, when playing a record for example, may induce hum in an incorrectly earthed cartridge.

Which is why i said "hits the record"  :roll:

Please explain, you are not being clear.

Read my post again, the one that you selectively quote from, and then explain what I have said that is wrong.

TrevC's picture
Offline
Last seen: 1 month 2 weeks ago
Joined: 12/06/2013 - 10:07
Posts: 761
RE: Pro-ject Debut Carbon hum when record plays

davedotco wrote:

TrevC wrote:

davedotco wrote:

TrevC wrote:

BIGBERNARDBRESSLAW wrote:

davedotco wrote:

Earthing a turntable can be difficult, particularly if you do not know what you are doing.

Turntable earthing requires that each part of the player is connected to ground once and once only, the turntable, specifically the motor is earthed via the mains connection and is normally not an issue. The arm is usually earthed via a separate earth lead, though on some players it is connected to the screen on one of the channels of the phono lead. The cartridge is then earthier via the screens of the phono leads.

Problems can arise when parts of the player are inadvertently earthed twice, ie a metal bodied cartridge may be earthed by it's physical connection to the arm and by connection via the screened cable to the amplifier, sometimes this is obvious, as when an external link can be seen connecting the metal of the cartridge body to one of the pins on the cartridge. Sometimes these links are internal or accidental and you can't see them, more difficult.

Other issues may arise from the design of the amplifier, in many modern designs the electronics are isolated from the chassis and 'floats', in others the electronics are earthed to the chassis of the amplifier and then to the mains. It might be possible to have the arm connected to the chassis ground but the ground on the cartridge connected to the 'floating' electronics,hence hum.

The issue needs to be tackled in a methodical manner by someone who knows what they are doing, often the manufacturer/distributer will not have te range of experience to be able to help, this is one for a competent dealer if you are lucky enough to know one.

Now that's what I meant to say. :grin:

 

If it only occurs when the stylus hits the record it can't be an earthing issue.

Not entirely true, getting the cartridge close to the motor, when playing a record for example, may induce hum in an incorrectly earthed cartridge.

Which is why i said "hits the record"  :roll:

Please explain, you are not being clear.

Read my post again, the one that you selectively quote from, and then explain what I have said that is wrong.

I was perfectly clear. An earth hum would be present whether the record is playing or not.

davedotco's picture
Offline
Last seen: 14 hours 41 min ago
Joined: 24/04/2013 - 10:02
Posts: 3556
RE: Pro-ject Debut Carbon hum when record plays

TrevC wrote:

davedotco wrote:

TrevC wrote:

davedotco wrote:

TrevC wrote:

BIGBERNARDBRESSLAW wrote:

davedotco wrote:

Earthing a turntable can be difficult, particularly if you do not know what you are doing.

Turntable earthing requires that each part of the player is connected to ground once and once only, the turntable, specifically the motor is earthed via the mains connection and is normally not an issue. The arm is usually earthed via a separate earth lead, though on some players it is connected to the screen on one of the channels of the phono lead. The cartridge is then earthier via the screens of the phono leads.

Problems can arise when parts of the player are inadvertently earthed twice, ie a metal bodied cartridge may be earthed by it's physical connection to the arm and by connection via the screened cable to the amplifier, sometimes this is obvious, as when an external link can be seen connecting the metal of the cartridge body to one of the pins on the cartridge. Sometimes these links are internal or accidental and you can't see them, more difficult.

Other issues may arise from the design of the amplifier, in many modern designs the electronics are isolated from the chassis and 'floats', in others the electronics are earthed to the chassis of the amplifier and then to the mains. It might be possible to have the arm connected to the chassis ground but the ground on the cartridge connected to the 'floating' electronics,hence hum.

The issue needs to be tackled in a methodical manner by someone who knows what they are doing, often the manufacturer/distributer will not have te range of experience to be able to help, this is one for a competent dealer if you are lucky enough to know one.

Now that's what I meant to say. :grin:

 

If it only occurs when the stylus hits the record it can't be an earthing issue.

Not entirely true, getting the cartridge close to the motor, when playing a record for example, may induce hum in an incorrectly earthed cartridge.

Which is why i said "hits the record"  :roll:

Please explain, you are not being clear.

Read my post again, the one that you selectively quote from, and then explain what I have said that is wrong.

I was perfectly clear. An earth hum would be present whether the record is playing or not.

Thank you for the clarification, as I thought you are wrong.

To play a record the cartridge needs to traverse the record in the normal manner. It is entirely possible that a cartridge that is poorly grounded could pick up an induced hum as it traverses the record and gets closer to the motor, the hum varies with the position of the cartridge, I have seen this happen.

What I was trying to explain to the OP was that this can be checked by moving the arm and cartridge across the record but not in contact with the record but with the motor running. If the hum is induced then it will occur whether the stylus is touching the record or not.

With the arm at rest, the cartridge is a good distance from the motor so there is no hum, as it traverses the record it gets closer to the motor and starts to hum, not common but should be checked out.

GAJ's picture
Offline
Last seen: 1 month 2 weeks ago
Joined: 04/09/2014 - 16:50
Posts: 1
Had the problem, completely gone after investing a buck.

I found the fix for myself and many others on the AVS Forum.

This site won't let me copy and past from the 2 Channel Audio section of that forum so in a nutshell.

Remove the 2 motor mount screws, install 2 small neoprene washers from home depot and a small metal washer on each side and replace the 2 motor mount screws tightening down medium tight, not full tight

I also had bad RCA cables with my Project Carbon; they were so loose they caused hum and would actually slip off the RCA jacks if you so much as moved the turntable.  Replaced with some old RCA cables I had laying around that fit tightly.

Hum problems completely eliminated.

Good luck.

 

 

Pages

Log in or register to post comments