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RE: Naim Vertical Form - Active Speakers???

John Duncan wrote:
Or, indeed, for about the last three years.

Italian Admiral: But, Señora Perón, it's an easy mistake. I'm still called an admiral, though I gave up the sea long ago.

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RE: Naim Vertical Form - Active Speakers???

philipjohnwright wrote:

I'm afraid I'm with the naysayers on this one, based purely on its price. Naim make very good equipment and I'm happy with the concept of premium pricing for a premium product. There is a limit though, and $200,000 is frankly way past it, whether it's Naim or any other manufacturer.

Put it into context, the same money buys you a brand spanking new Bentley. That is a premium product at a premium price but you can at least see where the cost comes from. Significant investment in R&D, a complex supply chain, high material costs, lots (compared to audio) of clever engineering etc etc. 

Ultimately if people want to spend that much on hifi (of any flavour) then it's their money. Those defending the ultra high end are often those bemoaning the lack of credibility that hi fi has these days though - it's not cool like it was in the 60's etc. No chance of returning to that position if we keep going in this direction. 

All of which is said with a twinge of sadness, not anger. And I'd quite happily live with Naim kit so I'm not bashing them per se. I just wish someone would lead by example. Yes I know, naive! 

Edit - add Light Harmonic's new $120,000 DAC to the argument so that it doesn't become an anti-Naim tirade. 

Cars depreciate, become unreliable, become a maintenance burden - yes such people are insanely wealthy but kudos to them if they see more value in hifi than a modern Bentley. Not saying you have to spend even a fraction of such a ludicrous sum, but a really good hifi can be really inspiring, and such pleasure is very rare indeed, apart from male to female contact of-course Wink

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RE: Naim Vertical Form - Active Speakers???

philipjohnwright wrote:

I'm afraid I'm with the naysayers on this one, based purely on its price. Naim make very good equipment and I'm happy with the concept of premium pricing for a premium product. There is a limit though, and $200,000 is frankly way past it, whether it's Naim or any other manufacturer.

Put it into context, the same money buys you a brand spanking new Bentley. That is a premium product at a premium price but you can at least see where the cost comes from. Significant investment in R&D, a complex supply chain, high material costs, lots (compared to audio) of clever engineering etc etc. 

Ultimately if people want to spend that much on hifi (of any flavour) then it's their money. Those defending the ultra high end are often those bemoaning the lack of credibility that hi fi has these days though - it's not cool like it was in the 60's etc. No chance of returning to that position if we keep going in this direction. 

All of which is said with a twinge of sadness, not anger. And I'd quite happily live with Naim kit so I'm not bashing them per se. I just wish someone would lead by example. Yes I know, naive! 

Edit - add Light Harmonic's new $120,000 DAC to the argument so that it doesn't become an anti-Naim tirade. 

 

I respectfully disagree...

 

I think people blame the general lack of interest in HiFi on all the wrong things... I don't think very expensive statement products have much (if anything) to do with the lowered interest in HiFi compared to the 60s. 

 

What's happened to HiFi is the same thing that happened to radio and newspapers and later watching music videos on TV... Newer technology captures the public's imagination. HiFi will never return to the "Golden Age" simply because there are too many more advanced alternatives for the general public. 

 

Why would young persons get subscriptions to newspapers and magazines when they can read all the same info, at their convenience, online? Why listen to the radio when you could watch a music video on TV? Which evolved to: why wait around in the hopes of seeing a music video you like on TV, when you can instantly stream any video you want on Youtube? Tech changes and so too does the tastes of the general public. 

 

The thought of listening in a dimly lit room to the intricate details of the music and imagining the singer is in front of you on a stage is far too old school for many persons... Why not just watch a concert on your 60" HDTV? No need to close your eyes and imagine the singer, since now you can see him/her... 

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RE: Naim Vertical Form - Active Speakers???

Here is a tip for everyone looking for VFM in this hugely expensive amp.

They naimed it the  S  T  A  T  E  M  E  N  T.   

 

B&W CM1 + FS-700/CM + Roksan Kandy K2 BT + Native Instruments TA2 + Commodore 64 LPSU + Audioquest Type 4

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RE: Naim Vertical Form - Active Speakers???

Ajani wrote:

philipjohnwright wrote:

I'm afraid I'm with the naysayers on this one, based purely on its price. Naim make very good equipment and I'm happy with the concept of premium pricing for a premium product. There is a limit though, and $200,000 is frankly way past it, whether it's Naim or any other manufacturer.

Put it into context, the same money buys you a brand spanking new Bentley. That is a premium product at a premium price but you can at least see where the cost comes from. Significant investment in R&D, a complex supply chain, high material costs, lots (compared to audio) of clever engineering etc etc. 

Ultimately if people want to spend that much on hifi (of any flavour) then it's their money. Those defending the ultra high end are often those bemoaning the lack of credibility that hi fi has these days though - it's not cool like it was in the 60's etc. No chance of returning to that position if we keep going in this direction. 

All of which is said with a twinge of sadness, not anger. And I'd quite happily live with Naim kit so I'm not bashing them per se. I just wish someone would lead by example. Yes I know, naive! 

Edit - add Light Harmonic's new $120,000 DAC to the argument so that it doesn't become an anti-Naim tirade. 

 

I respectfully disagree...

 

I think people blame the general lack of interest in HiFi on all the wrong things... I don't think very expensive statement products have much (if anything) to do with the lowered interest in HiFi compared to the 60s. 

 

What's happened to HiFi is the same thing that happened to radio and newspapers and later watching music videos on TV... Newer technology captures the public's imagination. HiFi will never return to the "Golden Age" simply because there are too many more advanced alternatives for the general public. 

 

Why would young persons get subscriptions to newspapers and magazines when they can read all the same info, at their convenience, online? Why listen to the radio when you could watch a music video on TV? Which evolved to: why wait around in the hopes of seeing a music video you like on TV, when you can instantly stream any video you want on Youtube? Tech changes and so too does the tastes of the general public. 

 

The thought of listening in a dimly lit room to the intricate details of the music and imagining the singer is in front of you on a stage is far too old school for many persons... Why not just watch a concert on your 60" HDTV? No need to close your eyes and imagine the singer, since now you can see him/her... 

Old school for who??? And your spotty teenage kid will soon demand a turntable. Some don't want to watch a concert on a TV because it's simply not the same as pure audio listening. And are there video concerts of all your favourite albums?? Yeah, thought not. It's important to seperate the wheat from the chaff, genuine progress from flavour-of-the-hour.

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RE: Naim Vertical Form - Active Speakers???

Ajani wrote:

What's happened to HiFi is the same thing that happened to radio...

You mean like how you can now listen to it on FM, AM, DAB, Freeview and the Internet?  Or how you can stream it to any number of devices including smartphones and tablets? And use iPlayer for catch-up services, listening in real time and podcasts?

Or did you mean it was like radio inasmuch as 47.7 million listen to it every week (90 percent of UK population aged 15+) for an average of 21.7 hours per listener per week.  (Source RAJAR Q3 2013.)

Or maybe you meant it was like the way in which tens of thousands of internet radio stations from all over the globe can now be heard clearly even when you are out-and-about and just using a small phone and some earbuds. (Unlike the 'Golden Age' when a receiver the size of a suitcase was required to pull in distant stations with the aid of an antenna twice the height of the average house!)    

I think you picked the wrong medium for an example of something that has declined from it's 'Golden Age'.

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RE: Naim Vertical Form - Active Speakers???

chebby wrote:

You mean like how you can now listen to it on FM, AM, DAB, Freeview and the Internet?  Or how you can stream it to any number of devices including smartphones and tablets? And use iPlayer for catch-up services, listening in real time and podcasts?

Or did you mean it was like radio inasmuch as 47.7 million listen to it every week (90 percent of UK population aged 15+) for an average of 21.7 hours per listener per week.  (Source RAJAR Q3 2013.)

Or maybe you meant it was like the way in which tens of thousands of internet radio stations from all over the globe can now be heard clearly even when you are out-and-about and just using a small phone and some earbuds. (Unlike the 'Golden Age' when a receiver the size of a suitcase was required to pull in distant stations with the aid of an antenna twice the height of the average house!)    

I think you picked the wrong medium for an example of something that has declined from it's 'Golden Age'.

Very interesting post Chebby. It really puts into perspective how far modern radio technology has come.

 

Many people here seem to think that the 'Golden Age' of hifi has passed because few people buy record players any more and plug them into of big square ugly hifi boxes which sit on a hifi rack. Hifi is still alive and kicking though but it's just evolved into new (and IMO) much better forms such as the one described above.

Hi-Fi - Epiphany Acoustics EHP-02Di > AVI DM5

Head-Fi - Epiphany Acoustics EHP-O2Di > Sennheisser HD700

Portable - Sony NWZ-A847 > Westone UM3x

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RE: Naim Vertical Form - Active Speakers???

Not really, it puts in perspective how far the humble cellphone has come - it can do all of the above and fits (mostly) in the palm of your hand. The cellphone is the new hifi, and it makes phone calls too.

And for that you can thank Apple, loathe or love them - and this is straight from the horses mouth - Google's Eric Schmidt recently admitted that 6 years ago he started his mobile hardware design from scratch when the iPhone was revealed.

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RE: Naim Vertical Form - Active Speakers???

steve_1979 wrote:

Very interesting post Chebby. It really puts into perspective how far modern radio technology has come.

Many people here seem to think that the 'Golden Age' of hifi has passed because few people buy record players any more and plug them into of big square ugly hifi boxes which sit on a hifi rack. Hifi is still alive and kicking though but it's just evolved into new (and IMO) much better forms such as the one described above.

Not so fast, althought WHF revealed declining figures, CD sales are still extremely strong. So traditional hifi lives on in rude health.

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RE: Naim Vertical Form - Active Speakers???

manicm wrote:

Not really, it puts in perspective how far the humble cellphone has come - it can do all of the above and fits (mostly) in the palm of your hand. The cellphone is the new hifi, and it makes phone calls too.

Mine does all that. Plays up when I want to make a phone call tho. Spose I'll have to download an app to be able to do that. ROFL
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RE: Naim Vertical Form - Active Speakers???

manicm wrote:

Not so fast, althought WHF revealed declining figures, CD sales are still extremely strong. So traditional hifi lives on in rude health.

CD sales are very strong in my house too. I just don't play them.

My purchase of CDs has gone up dramatically since I stopped playing them. (About 3 years ago.)

So you can't directly link sales of the disks to the use of CD players.

 

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RE: Naim Vertical Form - Active Speakers???

Richard Allen wrote:

manicm wrote:

Not really, it puts in perspective how far the humble cellphone has come - it can do all of the above and fits (mostly) in the palm of your hand. The cellphone is the new hifi, and it makes phone calls too.

Mine does all that. Plays up when I want to make a phone call tho. Spose I'll have to download an app to be able to do that. ROFL

 

My mobile actually has a phone app. I was beside myself upon making this discovery.

And no, Manic, there's much more to the progress of radio then MP3 players and, if you don't think so, you need to read Chebby's post again.

On th eother hand, I would like them to stop messing with certain programmes, and would like DAB to actually live up to its reputation a little better (I can't actually get some stations I should be able to), and I can't get all the stations on Freesat that I can on my DAB radio which is a shame.

But then 90% or more of my listening is 5 Live (which I was on recently. I don't feel I've milked that enough in these parts...).

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RE: Naim Vertical Form - Active Speakers???

Alec wrote:

But then 90% or more of my listening is 5 Live (which I was on recently. I don't feel I've milked that enough in these parts...).

oooookkkkkaaaaayyyyyyy.  Why were you on Five Live recently?

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RE: Naim Vertical Form - Active Speakers???

Talking about the first episode of the new series of Sherlock. I said very little in the event; they should just have read my texts.

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RE: Naim Vertical Form - Active Speakers???

Alec wrote:

Talking about the first episode of the new series of Sherlock. I said very little in the event; they should just have read my texts.

Were they funnier?

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