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RE: KEF LS50 disappointment :(

zakblue wrote:

Hi,

I am a bit of a Kef freak. I own a pair of Kef Concertos from the 70s, 3 pairs of Q300 bookshelves and a pair of r500 floorstanders.I've owned the Q900 floorstanders too but sold them a while back. I also used to own the Ref 104ab.

Whilst I really wanted to love the LS50s, I actually can agree with the 'sitting there with blank faces' comment. Something about the sound of the LS50s just doesn't do it for me, at all. It's like it's missing something. It's especially apparent if you want to hear huge orchestral textures or mid to lower strings and lower brass

I borrowed a pair of these off a mate of mine because I was considering them for my bedroom but in the end I didn't purchase them as they seemed to have 'no love' in the sound. I actually much prefer the sound of the cheaper Q300s and can reccomend these wholheartedly as an alternative. I use these in a 5.1 configuration with 1 acting as a center channel.

Anyway just my opinion and I know there are die hard LS50 fans everywhere but the speakers also show up in the 2nd hand market very often,

Will be interested to hear how you go!

Zak

Thank you for your comment, Zak.

Shows it may not just be me being a 'newbie' 

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RE: Lots of unfair remarks being

MarkJones83 wrote:
Lots of unfair remarks being made here, maybe i havent made myself clear. My friends Q1's sound better than my LS50's in terms of bass but they still have the clarity and thats what im after. No doubt people will now say that i should sell the LS50's and get some Q1's . I want my £800 speakers to sound the best they can be and clearly they can sound better than Q1's so why dont they?? I didnt mention before but the reason i started looking into hifi was after hearing a friends Klipsch RF-5's. They sounded brilliant and exactly what i was after but sadly i couldnt find any. I heard they were put into reproduction again for a short while but now discontinued again.

Sorry Mark, not trying to be rude but sometimes, when you do not know what you are doing and simply don't understand why things are sounding the way they are, it is best to get the help of a decent dealer.

You need someone who will take you through some of the basics and show you what makes a difference and what kind of equipment will give you the sound that you are looking for. Given some of your comments above I think you would have struggled to buy a more inappropriate pair of speakers than the LS50s, for your requirements anyway.

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RE: KEF LS50 disappointment :(

Hi Mark,

 

for now i think you need to stay put, don't think in new amp! 

To get a solution at this time should be a step by step process, through elimination of factors. 

Positive points

- you have the speakers on stands

- the stands are fill with sand 

Points to work out

- try the speaker with a new amp at a decent dealer they will get 

the best of them for you and you can see if they are for you or not. 

After that you can think in what ever you want.

 

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RE: KEF LS50 disappointment :(

Is that amp a home theatre jobbie? If so, can it and get a decent NAD stereo amp. that'll make a world of difference.

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RE: Had tried doing some online

MarkJones83 wrote:
Had tried doing some online research on what amps would make good pairing with the LS50's. The Nait was one of the ones recommended, on this forum i believe.

As well as Naim being recommended, so has Creek (50A), Arcam (A19), Rega (Brio R), Musical Fidelity (M3i), Exposure (2010 S2) and Harman Kardon (HK990)....to name but a few.

A little more expensive - Unison Research (Unico Primo), Electrcompaniet (PI-1), Denson (B-110 Plus), Leema (Elements) and Audio Analogue (Puccini Settanta Rev.2).

So please don't buy the Naim without listening to some alternatives (with your speakers)......that will give you some personal perspective (which can't be given by someone else with any degree of certainty).

"We should no more let numbers define audio quality than we should let chemical analysis be the arbiter of fine wines."  Nelson Pass

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Ok, thanks for all

Ok, thanks for all responses.

Will try them out on my friends amp to begin with and then see if i can borrow a decent amp from a local dealer and get it set up by them to see how its sounding.

Funny you should mention the cinema amp, i had wondered if perhaps it was the wrong kind of amp.

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RE: Ok, thanks for all

MarkJones83 wrote:
Ok, thanks for all responses. Will try them out on my friends amp to begin with and then see if i can borrow a decent amp from a local dealer and get it set up by them to see how its sounding. Funny you should mention the cinema amp, i had wondered if perhaps it was the wrong kind of amp.

The LS50s are pretty revealing of weaknesses up stream from them, be it amp, source or bit rate.

"We should no more let numbers define audio quality than we should let chemical analysis be the arbiter of fine wines."  Nelson Pass

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RE: Lots of unfair remarks being

MarkJones83 wrote:
Lots of unfair remarks being made here, maybe i havent made myself clear. My friends Q1's sound better than my LS50's in terms of bass but they still have the clarity and thats what im after. No doubt people will now say that i should sell the LS50's and get some Q1's . I want my £800 speakers to sound the best they can be and clearly they can sound better than Q1's so why dont they?? I didnt mention before but the reason i started looking into hifi was after hearing a friends Klipsch RF-5's. They sounded brilliant and exactly what i was after but sadly i couldnt find any. I heard they were put into reproduction again for a short while but now discontinued again.

 

Well the LS50 are not very sensitive and IMO need good amplification, the Q1 are more sensitive and can get away with a less quality amp. I think if you want your LS50 to sound good then you need to spend quite a lot on an amp, the NAim is not the most powerful amp so not sure thats the answer. To be honest I think you should sell them and buy some Q1s or similar.

Klipsch RF-5' are large floorstanders, so if you want something like that you could look at some FS maybe Epos or Tannoys? 

 

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RE: When you say you have "played

David@FrankHarvey wrote:
When you say you have "played around with the settings", which ones have you played with? Are the speakers set to large? Any EQ (manual on the 3090) being used? Is the bass output set to speaker, sub, or both? While the LS50 won't dig as deep as larger bookshelf or floorstanders (it's only a 5.25" bass/midrange driver, part of which is a HF unit), their tonal balance certainly doesn't lack bass. The old Q1's will sound quite lean compared to the LS50's, so something somewhere is wrong. Whether this is a speaker problem or a set up issue, more investigation is needed. The older DSPA1000 had a tendancy to become a little bright at the top end when pushed, so it wouldn't be unreasonable to think this could be an issue with the 3090 as well. I can't say for certain, but from memory I found the 3090 a little warmer and smoother, so maybe it is a case of the amplifier overstepping its comfort zone at higher volumes?

Thanks for your response, Dave.

Yes speakers set to 'large' and bass output to 'speakers', havent got a sub. I'm a bit of a technophobe so i had a friend who's much more clued up than me to get out the manual and go into the settings. Will ask local dealer as advised. To be honest i really didnt imagine it would be this complicated. I have a reasonably good amp which ran the RF-5's very nicely, i bought the stands and cables etc and then asked friends who are into hifi to do the setup for me. Dont know how a previous poster could say i didnt follow or ask for advice. 

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RE: KEF LS50 disappointment :(

Don't worry about ddc, mate, he tends to get a bit over the top at times.

 

Seriously, though, that yammie is the last amp to use with quality speakers. I'm not a fan of  those kefs, but what they're doing is revealing weaknesses of the amp. Generally, home theatre amps and quality speakers are a bit of a no no. See if you can borrow a proper stereo amp from a dealer at around the 80w mark and give it a go. Think you'll be stunned at the difference.

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RE: When you say you have "played

MarkJones83 wrote:

David@FrankHarvey wrote:
When you say you have "played around with the settings", which ones have you played with? Are the speakers set to large? Any EQ (manual on the 3090) being used? Is the bass output set to speaker, sub, or both? While the LS50 won't dig as deep as larger bookshelf or floorstanders (it's only a 5.25" bass/midrange driver, part of which is a HF unit), their tonal balance certainly doesn't lack bass. The old Q1's will sound quite lean compared to the LS50's, so something somewhere is wrong. Whether this is a speaker problem or a set up issue, more investigation is needed. The older DSPA1000 had a tendancy to become a little bright at the top end when pushed, so it wouldn't be unreasonable to think this could be an issue with the 3090 as well. I can't say for certain, but from memory I found the 3090 a little warmer and smoother, so maybe it is a case of the amplifier overstepping its comfort zone at higher volumes?

Thanks for your response, Dave.

Yes speakers set to 'large' and bass output to 'speakers', havent got a sub. I'm a bit of a technophobe so i had a friend who's much more clued up than me to get out the manual and go into the settings. Will ask local dealer as advised. To be honest i really didnt imagine it would be this complicated. I have a reasonably good amp which ran the RF-5's very nicely, i bought the stands and cables etc and then asked friends who are into hifi to do the setup for me. Dont know how a previous poster could say i didnt follow or ask for advice. 

Advice from a competent dealer who can demonstrate the differences and help you to find what works for you, not some mates who are 'into hi-fi' and may or may not know what they are doing.

Not the same thing at all.

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RE: When you say you have "played

MarkJones83 wrote:

David@FrankHarvey wrote:
When you say you have "played around with the settings", which ones have you played with? Are the speakers set to large? Any EQ (manual on the 3090) being used? Is the bass output set to speaker, sub, or both? While the LS50 won't dig as deep as larger bookshelf or floorstanders (it's only a 5.25" bass/midrange driver, part of which is a HF unit), their tonal balance certainly doesn't lack bass. The old Q1's will sound quite lean compared to the LS50's, so something somewhere is wrong. Whether this is a speaker problem or a set up issue, more investigation is needed. The older DSPA1000 had a tendancy to become a little bright at the top end when pushed, so it wouldn't be unreasonable to think this could be an issue with the 3090 as well. I can't say for certain, but from memory I found the 3090 a little warmer and smoother, so maybe it is a case of the amplifier overstepping its comfort zone at higher volumes?

Dont know how a previous poster could say i didnt follow or ask for advice. 

 

I think he meant before you bought them. It seems you bought them on the back of a review and recommendation which IMHO is not the way to do it. I would either change the amp or speakers but go to a decent dealer (not richers) and try various systems out.

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RE: When you say you have "played

MarkJones83 wrote:

Thanks for your response, Dave.

Yes speakers set to 'large' and bass output to 'speakers', havent got a sub. I'm a bit of a technophobe so i had a friend who's much more clued up than me to get out the manual and go into the settings. Will ask local dealer as advised. To be honest i really didnt imagine it would be this complicated. I have a reasonably good amp which ran the RF-5's very nicely, i bought the stands and cables etc and then asked friends who are into hifi to do the setup for me. Dont know how a previous poster could say i didnt follow or ask for advice. 

My Yamaha AV amp (can't remember the model) has a 'music direct' or 'audio direct' (may have that wrong) option which defeats all the funny AV circuits. I think this does make a difference -- though i doubt that this alone will solve your particular problem.

The screen door slams, Mary's dress waves ...

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RE: KEF LS50 disappointment :(

altruistic.lemon wrote:

Don't worry about ddc, mate, he tends to get a bit over the top at times.

 

Seriously, though, that yammie is the last amp to use with quality speakers. I'm not a fan of  those kefs, but what they're doing is revealing weaknesses of the amp. Generally, home theatre amps and quality speakers are a bit of a no no. See if you can borrow a proper stereo amp from a dealer at around the 80w mark and give it a go. Think you'll be stunned at the difference.

Not if he wants it to sound like a car stereo or a pair of Klipsch he won't...... :read:

 

And Al, I appreciate that the modern way is to blame the messenger but when the OP has already spent good money on a pair of inappropriate speakers and is considering blowing a similar amount on an equally inappropriate amplifier I thought I was being pretty restrained.... Wink

Edit for lousy spelling.

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RE: When you say you have "played

 

[/quote]

My Yamaha AV amp (can't remember the model) has a 'music direct' or 'audio direct' (may have that wrong) option which defeats all the funny AV circuits. I think this does make a difference -- though i doubt that this alone will solve your particular problem.

[/quote]

May be worth a try Smile

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