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dimedrol's picture
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Entry level amps aren't capable to drive Proac Studio 110

Hi from Russia

I have problems driving my Proac Studio 110 with mid power amps. I tried Marantz 6003 and Rotel 972, both produce bass-less sound, that is they play around 25% of what should be played below 100 Hz. Phasing was correct, I also tried different cables, sources.

I realize the amps I have tried are not a good match for the Proacs but I assume they must play bass (of whatever quality, at the moment I don't care). Naim nait 5i is less powerful than the Rotel but it is said to be a good match for the Proacs. Arcam budget amps owners reported they were able to drive Proacs well.

Are my speakers misfunctioning? Is there something special about the two amps that they can't make Proacs play bass?

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RE: Entry level amps aren't capable to drive Proac Studio 110

Have used Audiolab 8000A to drive small ProAc's without problems.

 

Best regards

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RE: Entry level amps aren't capable to drive Proac Studio 110

Hi, I would suggest you get a more powerful amp to drive the Proacs.....you can look at the second hand market, an audiolab 8000 would do nicely for instance and shouldn't be more than 200 pounds.

Regards,

Shafin

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RE: Entry level amps aren't capable to drive Proac Studio 110

I was going to order Cambridge Audio 840A which seems to have more than enough power for the Proacs. But if that guy doesn't bring the bass back I am in big trouble, cause I am going to own the Proacs that don't play bass and the  amp which is of no use.

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RE: Entry level amps aren't capable to drive Proac Studio 110

Where bass is concerned, there could be a lot of factors involved like:

- Size of room
- Positioning of speakers
- Type and quality of speaker stands (whether filled or not)
- Construction/shape/decor of room
- Quality of amp/source
- Speaker cable
- The speaker design itself

FWIW. The most VFM powerful amp I'm aware of, is the Harman Kardon HK 990....which also has room EQ.

"We should no more let numbers define audio quality than we should let chemical analysis be the arbiter of fine wines."  Nelson Pass

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RE: Entry level amps aren't capable to drive Proac Studio 110

I agree that there are many factors influencing bass perception. But the thing is, with the two amps that I have my Proacs are so obviously bassless that I am confident there's something wrong with them or with the amps I use. My small active Adam monitors which I use as computer speakers produce MUCH more bass and they only have 5.5" woofer (the Proacs have 6.5"). Only when I set Bass knob at maximum level on the Marantz they start play moreless low but the bass is out of control.

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RE: Entry level amps aren't capable to drive Proac Studio 110

I've been having the same issue with my Proac 110s and had a home demo with a 840A V2. There was no more bass than with my current Cyrus 8vs2 so I returned it. I think you need to look elsewhere for a bassier presentation.

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RE: Entry level amps aren't capable to drive Proac Studio 110

This is a silly one to say, but have you made sure nagative & positive cables are right way round. cause that happened to me when I got new speakers, being the right post was now positive compared to my old speakers. The bass sounded really wrong & absent.  Is it posible to move the speakers to another locate in room. sometimes room acoustics can be problematic in some areas of the room.

I have had a listen to the marantz & its not lacking in bass at all. So u may need to move stuff around & see if u get a better result.

 OPPO 105EU, Arcam AVR450, Boston Acoustics M340. Dac: Musical fedility V90.

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RE: Entry level amps aren't capable to drive Proac Studio 110

Brendj wrote:

I've been having the same issue with my Proac 110s and had a home demo with a 840A V2. There was no more bass than with my current Cyrus 8vs2 so I returned it. I think you need to look elsewhere for a bassier presentation.

 

Do you use them without bass? I am confused because so far I heard from three different low-power amps owners that they drive Proacs well (Audiolab, Arcam and Naim). And my own experience with Rotel and Marantz is discouraging. It's not like I have hyped bass demands, no. I used to listen to the active studio monitors daily during last few years and they do have pretty flat frequency response which is totally ok for  me, but the Proacs are just truly bassless with my amps

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RE: Entry level amps aren't capable to drive Proac Studio 110

Native_bon wrote:

This is a silly one to say, but have you made sure nagative & positive cables are right way round. cause that happened to me when I got new speakers, being the right post was now positive compared to my old speakers. The bass sounded really wrong & absent.  Is it posible to move the speakers to another locate in room. sometimes room acoustics can be problematic in some areas of the room.

I have had a listen to the marantz & its not lacking in bass at all. So u may need to move stuff around & see if u get a better result.

I checked phasing with an AA battery and also using audio test CD, it was ok. Also I can see that the woofer is moving very little for the volume level

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RE: Entry level amps aren't capable to drive Proac Studio 110

Brendj wrote:

I've been having the same issue with my Proac 110s and had a home demo with a 840A V2. There was no more bass than with my current Cyrus 8vs2 so I returned it. I think you need to look elsewhere for a bassier presentation.

This.  It's been a while since I demoed a pair (using a Roksan Kandy L.lll amp) but my impression at the time was that they were bass-light.  I was comparing them to PMC DB1i's and Dynaudio Audience 52 at the time.

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RE: Entry level amps aren't capable to drive Proac Studio 110

If you really like the speakers but you find them basslight with just about every amp you've tried, this might be a good opportunity to add a graphic equaliser. A graphic equaliser will allow you to fine-tune the tone more precisely than the bass and treble controls on an amp. Typically you would wire it into an amp's tape-loop, or if you only have one source (eg CD player), you could wire it between the source and the amp.
But even with an equaliser, if the Proacs really are not capable of delivering the kind of bass you're looking for, you could still end up disappointed.

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RE: Entry level amps aren't capable to drive Proac Studio 110

I would really not like to bring extra hardware to the system to make it sound the way it is supposed to by default. It just doesn't feel right. I don't think Proacs were designed to sound the way mine do, I still assume there's something wrong with my setup or the speakers are malfunctioning.

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RE: Entry level amps aren't capable to drive Proac Studio 110

MajorFubar wrote:
If you really like the speakers but you find them basslight with just about every amp you've tried, this might be a good opportunity to add a graphic equaliser. A graphic equaliser will allow you to fine-tune the tone more precisely than the bass and treble controls on an amp. Typically you would wire it into an amp's tape-loop, or if you only have one source (eg CD player), you could wire it between the source and the amp. But even with an equaliser, if the Proacs really are not capable of delivering the kind of bass you're looking for, you could still end up disappointed.

Equaslier will only add noise to the singal.. Thats my opinion. May be u are yet to give the proac the kind of amp they like.

 OPPO 105EU, Arcam AVR450, Boston Acoustics M340. Dac: Musical fedility V90.

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RE: Entry level amps aren't capable to drive Proac Studio 110

dimedrol wrote:

Hi from Russia

I have problems driving my Proac Studio 110 with mid power amps. I tried Marantz 6003 and Rotel 972, both produce bass-less sound, that is they play around 25% of what should be played below 100 Hz. Phasing was correct, I also tried different cables, sources.

I realize the amps I have tried are not a good match for the Proacs but I assume they must play bass (of whatever quality, at the moment I don't care). Naim nait 5i is less powerful than the Rotel but it is said to be a good match for the Proacs. Arcam budget amps owners reported they were able to drive Proacs well.

Are my speakers misfunctioning? Is there something special about the two amps that they can't make Proacs play bass?

Personally I'd be demoing Primare I21. Have read that Primare and ProAc are an excellent combo, although can't confirm this...

Amp; CDP; Turntable; Tuner; Speakers

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RE: Entry level amps aren't capable to drive Proac Studio 110

dimedrol, when you say the Proacs have no bass as in only about 25% of what they should have below 100hz, that is compared to what? Some other speaker you've heard with the same recordings and the same source and amps in the same room? If so, which other speakers? Compared to the same recordings on some other system in some other room? If so, what system? Compared to live? Compared to what you think there should or what you'd like to be below 100hz? Or what you feel instinctively there should be?

 

In my experience when you match a tonally neutral low powered amp with low damping factor with demanding speakers what you get subjectively is the impression of more bass but looser, woollier bass. Getting a higher powered, higher damping factor amp subjectively produces the impression of less bass, but tighter, more tuneful, better textured, better quality bass.

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