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Better mastered music could be on the way!

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manicm's picture
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RE: Started with a rack system

Hmmm, now where is that receipt of that Prefab Sprout: Jordan The Comeback CD I forced my parents to buy me for my 17th birthday???? Does that store even exist anymore? banging head against wall doh! puzzled Oh enforcers here, where were you all those years ago listen to this

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RE: Started with a rack system

manicm wrote:

Hmmm, now where is that receipt of that Prefab Sprout: Jordan The Comeback CD I forced my parents to buy me for my 17th birthday???? Does that store even exist anymore? banging head against wall doh! puzzled Oh enforcers here, where were you all those years ago listen to this

Awww, you're over-tired, bless ya.

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manicm's picture
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RE: Started with a rack system

Alec wrote:

manicm wrote:

Hmmm, now where is that receipt of that Prefab Sprout: Jordan The Comeback CD I forced my parents to buy me for my 17th birthday???? Does that store even exist anymore? banging head against wall doh! puzzled Oh enforcers here, where were you all those years ago listen to this

Awww, you're over-tired, bless ya.

And on that note I shall get  some shut-eye Alec Smile

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the record spot's picture
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RE: Started with a rack system

Alec wrote:

manicm wrote:

Hmmm, now where is that receipt of that Prefab Sprout: Jordan The Comeback CD I forced my parents to buy me for my 17th birthday???? Does that store even exist anymore? banging head against wall doh! puzzled Oh enforcers here, where were you all those years ago listen to this

Awww, you're over-tired, bless ya.

 

rolling on the floor laughing    excellent!    rolling on the floor laughing

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RE: Started with a rack system

aaand....better mastered music could be on the way!   Shock

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the record spot's picture
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RE: Started with a rack system

Better mastered music has been with us for years Cno, but it's just not followed across the (mixing) board.  For every Barry Diament or Joe Gastwirt, there's somebody who's busy crunching something up into a near unlistenable mess. 

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RE: Started with a rack system

the record spot wrote:

Better mastered music has been with us for years Cno, but it's just not followed across the (mixing) board.  For every Barry Diament or Joe Gastwirt, there's somebody who's busy crunching something up into a near unlistenable mess. 

Not disagreeing......but giving a gentle reminder of what we're all supposed to be discussing. 

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RE: Better mastered music could be on the way!

Here's a reminder of what the loudness war is all about.

 

The Red Hot Chili Peppers album 'Californication' is famous for being one of the worst victims of the loudness war. The retail released CD version of this album is so bad that I actually thought the speakers were broken the first time I heard it on a decent hifi.

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Californication_(album)

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the record spot's picture
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RE: Started with a rack system

manicm wrote:

Hmmm, now where is that receipt of that Prefab Sprout: Jordan The Comeback CD I forced my parents to buy me for my 17th birthday???? Does that store even exist anymore? banging head against wall doh! puzzled Oh enforcers here, where were you all those years ago listen to this

 

That would've been your parents responsibility - nae luck son!

Jings, out of all the CDs ye've got, you had to pick to one you never bought... #epicfail

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shooter's picture
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RE: Better mastered music could be on the way!

steve_1979 wrote:

shooter wrote:

steve_1979 wrote:

The point is that they should both have the same amount of dynamic range.

They do.

No they do not.

 

Please take a careful look at these three pictures again. The downloaded Linn MP3 is differerent to the 'no compromise' studio FLAC version. But the MP3 that I converted myself looks (and sounds) exactly the same as the 24bit FLAC version.

 

 

Downloaded Linn MP3

 

Downloaded Linn 24bit FLAC (this is the 'no compromise' studio mastered version)

 

My MP3 converted from the Linn 24bit FLAC file

 

Yes see it now.

 

beauty, eh

shooter's picture
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RE: Better mastered music could be on the way!

The best speakers in the world only have a continuous SPL of 120db's, likes of BW and ATC's. And with room noise around 30 db's there is only around 90db's of listenable range, with lesser (normal) speakers around 75 to 80db's, 13bit.

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RE: Better mastered music

shooter wrote:

 . . .  around 90db's of listenable range, with lesser (normal) speakers around 75 to 80db's, 13bit.

 

Which is probably equivalent to, or a bit better than the best vinyl, most of which is about 10 to 12 bit equivalency, and can sound extremely good.

Properly implemented 16 bit CD sounds wonderful, with no surface noise, no end-of-side distortion, and dynamic range which exceeds human hearing and room environments.

Whilst 24 bit is necessary in the digital recording domain only (for mathematical reasons), no replay system can exceed approx 20 bit performance due to thermal noise at normal temperatures.  Even then human hearing cannot discern that level of performance by a long chalk.

Having made a 24 bit recording, there is no reason why it should not be used for replay purposes, other than file sizes, which consume bandwidth, but it is not possible for humans to appreciate anything better than 16 bit.

Sampling rates higher than 44kHz do not provide any humanly audible information, in the replay environment, but they do make the construction of the recording equipment slightly easier (filter slopes, etc),  Even this advantage is diminished by modern digital technology.

A well recorded, and well produced (sensibly mastered), recording is a pleasure to listen to, in the replay environment, regardless of medium or format.

JC

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RE: Better mastered music could be on the way!

shooter wrote:
Yes see it now.

 

 beauty, eh

Smile

beauty, eh

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RE: Better mastered music

jcbrum wrote:

shooter wrote:

 . . .  around 90db's of listenable range, with lesser (normal) speakers around 75 to 80db's, 13bit.

 

Which is probably equivalent to, or a bit better than the best vinyl, most of which is about 10 to 12 bit equivalency, and can sound extremely good.

Properly implemented 16 bit CD sounds wonderful, with no surface noise, no end-of-side distortion, and dynamic range which exceeds human hearing and room environments.

Whilst 24 bit is necessary in the digital recording domain only (for mathematical reasons), no replay system can exceed approx 20 bit performance due to thermal noise at normal temperatures.  Even then human hearing cannot discern that level of performance by a long chalk.

Having made a 24 bit recording, there is no reason why it should not be used for replay purposes, other than file sizes, which consume bandwidth, but it is not possible for humans to appreciate anything better than 16 bit.

Sampling rates higher than 44kHz do not provide any humanly audible information, in the replay environment, but they do make the construction of the recording equipment slightly easier (filter slopes, etc),  Even this advantage is diminished by modern digital technology.

A well recorded, and well produced (sensibly mastered), recording is a pleasure to listen to, in the replay environment, regardless of medium or format.

JC

good posting. we need more posts like this! improves S/N ratio.

steve_1979's picture
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RE: Better mastered music could be on the way!

steve_1979 wrote:

Here's a reminder of what the loudness war is all about.

 

The Red Hot Chili Peppers album 'Californication' is famous for being one of the worst victims of the loudness war. The retail released CD version of this album is so bad that I actually thought the speakers were broken the first time I heard it on a decent hifi.

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Californication_(album)

Here's a (very loosely) related thread on the AVI forum that you might find interesting.

http://hddaudio.net/viewtopic.php?id=5551

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